Deere Mack Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 Getting the dash waring lights, everything else is working fine, runs good etc. I have changed the cylinoid on side or radiator, changed heat sensor at rear of manifold. Still no luck. I would appreciate any help. I also look forward to using this forum and more than likely becoming very active within it. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
hatcity Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 coolant level?Check fuse? Quote Success is only a stones throw away.................................................................for a Palestinian Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48696 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted January 29, 2010 Author Share Posted January 29, 2010 coolant level?Check fuse?Coolant-good, fuse-have not been able to locate a specific fuse that allows the horton air fan to work? This all started when i blew the small hose between the water manifolds. Lost alot of fluid and steamed up the engine pretty good. But that was a month ago and should be good and dry by now? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48698 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 Coolant-good, fuse-have not been able to locate a specific fuse that allows the horton air fan to work? This all started when i blew the small hose between the water manifolds. Lost alot of fluid and steamed up the engine pretty good. But that was a month ago and should be good and dry by now?Is there a box beneath the coolant bottle if so look for FAN fuse! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48699 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted January 29, 2010 Author Share Posted January 29, 2010 I sure hope so, driving me crazy. I'll look first chance I get and post update. Thanks for the help! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48700 Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveigou Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 Maby this is a little dumb, and please forgive me if it is, but even if the coolant level is up in the overflow tank, it still may be possible for the coolant level to be low in the expansion tank, make sure you check it at both places.Dave Quote See my Flickr photostream page http://www.flickr.com/photos/96692978@N05/ Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48704 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambi80 Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 Maybe the low coolant sensor is bad in the recovery tank. Had that problem with mine...it would come on in-frequently and show engine shutdown/electronic malfunction lights, then ended up with it coming on every time I started the truck and eventually went off after it ran for a while. The sensor is about $12 and took 5 seconds to change. Quote Ever wonder how a blind person knows when to stop wiping? Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48705 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted January 30, 2010 Author Share Posted January 30, 2010 I appreciate everyones help. Would the coolant sensor etc. keep the solenoid from engaging the fan? My truck takes air to engage the fan, and the problem is the solenoid dosen't receive power to open up when the temp gets up. Plus the engine shutdown and electrical malfunction lights randomly go on and off. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48707 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambi80 Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 My bad, I guess I didn't pick up on your problem being the fan. I always thought that whenever something was wrong with the fan it would end up being stuck on. It not engaging...not good. Quote Ever wonder how a blind person knows when to stop wiping? Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48710 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted January 30, 2010 Author Share Posted January 30, 2010 My bad, I guess I didn't pick up on your problem being the fan. I always thought that whenever something was wrong with the fan it would end up being stuck on. It not engaging...not good.Its all good, the water level sensor could very well be my waring light problem (same symptoms) and the fan all together another problem. I just got the truck about a year ago and its my first big rig, so I'm learing alot fast! As of now I've got the selonoid bypassed and the fan runs all the time, but the problem still exists. I hope to get this big boy in top shape one day! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48720 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambi80 Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 Ahh man...good luck! I've had mine for over 3 years and I'm still trying to perfect it. Quote Ever wonder how a blind person knows when to stop wiping? Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48724 Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgallamore Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 that is a good lookin ch, i see you are new to this forum, ive only been here about 3 months, but have learned every body has good input on problems, but when fjh or mackpro68, makes a sugestion, take it serious, they are very sharp on this internet machanic stuff. every body on here has helped me. good luck with your fan prob. im sure it will be something cheap and simple. haha, nothing about trucks cheap or simple. Quote http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/uploads/1272400769/gallery_4852_794_314995.jpg Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambi80 Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 that is a good lookin ch, i see you are new to this forum, ive only been here about 3 months, but have learned every body has good input on problems, but when fjh or mackpro68, makes a sugestion, take it serious, they are very sharp on this internet machanic stuff. every body on here has helped me. good luck with your fan prob. im sure it will be something cheap and simple. haha, nothing about trucks cheap or simple.Looking at your picture, you got your new truck? How's it so far? Quote Ever wonder how a blind person knows when to stop wiping? Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48733 Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgallamore Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Looking at your picture, you got your new truck? How's it so far? waiting on parts they are supposed to send, then ill tell the whole story. Quote http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/uploads/1272400769/gallery_4852_794_314995.jpg Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48735 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted January 31, 2010 Author Share Posted January 31, 2010 that is a good lookin ch, i see you are new to this forum, ive only been here about 3 months, but have learned every body has good input on problems, but when fjh or mackpro68, makes a sugestion, take it serious, they are very sharp on this internet machanic stuff. every body on here has helped me. good luck with your fan prob. im sure it will be something cheap and simple. haha, nothing about trucks cheap or simple.I appreciate your comments bigen, you've got a fine looking truck yourself. Nice color! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-48782 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted February 7, 2010 Author Share Posted February 7, 2010 Ok, I've checked for any fuses for the fan soleniod in the engine compartment, results-negative(not to say there isn't). I did put a wire tracer on solenoid hook up and ended up at a air conditioner line on the oposite side of the radiator and another sensor. So, I got on BMT and found a similar topic with fan failure and someone said that the sensor was part of the fan operation and was know to go bad. Anyone have any input on this? Always appreciated. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49141 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Ok, I've checked for any fuses for the fan soleniod in the engine compartment, results-negative(not to say there isn't). I did put a wire tracer on solenoid hook up and ended up at a air conditioner line on the oposite side of the radiator and another sensor. So, I got on BMT and found a similar topic with fan failure and someone said that the sensor was part of the fan operation and was know to go bad. Anyone have any input on this? Always appreciated.Your year model is tricky because it could be either a VMAC1 or VMAC2 (engine electronics), all fuses and ECM's are in the cab on both models( unlike the ETECH style engine). VMAC1 had nothing to do with engine fan control, the fan control was kinda added on and not really part of the VMAC system.It had it's own 2 prong sending unit ontop of the water manifold, the degrees stamped on the sensor tells what temp it will engage(usually around 205) . When VMAC2 came out, it controlled the fan on/off. It used the existing temp sensor for the ECM to decide when to turn on the fan. The dealer could also raise and lower the engagement temp with a prolink computer. Both systems still used the same fan clutch and solinoid. Which light is coming on red shutdown or yellow electronic malfunction? If it's both it's the low water sensor or wiring to the sensor or really has low coolant. Is your metal radiator cap on the radiator itself or on an overflow/surge tank in the fire wall? Forgot to mention, love your truck, Alxe forward CH's are my faavorite! One of the best ones I ever drove was a 1990 with a E-7 400hp manual fuel pump, the old man that taught me all about Macks cranked the rpms and fuel to it and it was a screamer. The second best was a 1996 with a E-7 454hp it was awesome as well. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49254 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 Your year model is tricky because it could be either a VMAC1 or VMAC2 (engine electronics), all fuses and ECM's are in the cab on both models( unlike the ETECH style engine). VMAC1 had nothing to do with engine fan control, the fan control was kinda added on and not really part of the VMAC system.It had it's own 2 prong sending unit ontop of the water manifold, the degrees stamped on the sensor tells what temp it will engage(usually around 205) . When VMAC2 came out, it controlled the fan on/off. It used the existing temp sensor for the ECM to decide when to turn on the fan. The dealer could also raise and lower the engagement temp with a prolink computer. Both systems still used the same fan clutch and solinoid. Which light is coming on red shutdown or yellow electronic malfunction? If it's both it's the low water sensor or wiring to the sensor or really has low coolant. Is your metal radiator cap on the radiator itself or on an overflow/surge tank in the fire wall? Forgot to mention, love your truck, Alxe forward CH's are my faavorite! One of the best ones I ever drove was a 1990 with a E-7 400hp manual fuel pump, the old man that taught me all about Macks cranked the rpms and fuel to it and it was a screamer. The second best was a 1996 with a E-7 454hp it was awesome as well.Thanks for the info and comments Mack. Mine has the E7-427 and she'll pull around my JD 750C II Dozer like it isn't even back there. I'm goning to replace the water level sensor just to be able and rule it out on the Engine shutdown and Electrical Malfunction ligts. My fan takes air to engage it and thats the problem with the fan not getting power to open solinoid. Strangely enought this all happened at the same time, blew the manifold hose and saturated engine compartment and been having both problems since. Where exactly would the sensor on the manifold be for the solenoid? I was told it was at the very rear, and replaced that one with no luck. I have the overflow/surge tank on the fire wall. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49284 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjh Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 I think you'll find it just behind the thermastat housing . Doest your truck have AC the AC swithtch on the reciever may be fubar!Try jumping over the ac switch if it has one! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49286 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted February 9, 2010 Share Posted February 9, 2010 Thanks for the info and comments Mack. Mine has the E7-427 and she'll pull around my JD 750C II Dozer like it isn't even back there. I'm goning to replace the water level sensor just to be able and rule it out on the Engine shutdown and Electrical Malfunction ligts. My fan takes air to engage it and thats the problem with the fan not getting power to open solinoid. Strangely enought this all happened at the same time, blew the manifold hose and saturated engine compartment and been having both problems since. Where exactly would the sensor on the manifold be for the solenoid? I was told it was at the very rear, and replaced that one with no luck. I have the overflow/surge tank on the fire wall.The very back sensor that faces the firewall goes to the ECM, the one that faces out toward the hood goes only to the guage on the dash. Got snowed in today and am not at work so I cant look at the wiring diagram, I'll see what I can find tommorrow. Have you shot air directly to the fan clutch to see if it will engage or disengage( however it is set up)? I think a fuse in the fuse panel sends 12 volts to the solinoid all the time andcomes back and then grounds inside the ECM. The ECM will make the ground when it see's high R12 A/C head pressure, high water temp or high intake temp to engage the fan. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49287 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted February 9, 2010 Author Share Posted February 9, 2010 (edited) The very back sensor that faces the firewall goes to the ECM, the one that faces out toward the hood goes only to the guage on the dash. Got snowed in today and am not at work so I cant look at the wiring diagram, I'll see what I can find tommorrow. Have you shot air directly to the fan clutch to see if it will engage or disengage( however it is set up)? I think a fuse in the fuse panel sends 12 volts to the solenoid all the time andcomes back and then grounds inside the ECM. The ECM will make the ground when it see's high R12 A/C head pressure, high water temp or high intake temp to engage the fan.Ok, I think I might have told you wrong about my solenoid. If I unplug the solenoid it allows the fan to run continuously, so it takes power to the solenoid to turn it off, which evidently its getting. So I'm not getting the ground in the ECM to kill power and let fan run at high temp. This dont sound good, ECM problems? I haven't had a chance to check for volts (which now I know the solenoid is getting), the truck is still at a job site. Edited February 9, 2010 by Deere Mack Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49290 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted February 12, 2010 Share Posted February 12, 2010 Ok, I think I might have told you wrong about my solenoid. If I unplug the solenoid it allows the fan to run continuously, so it takes power to the solenoid to turn it off, which evidently its getting. So I'm not getting the ground in the ECM to kill power and let fan run at high temp. This dont sound good, ECM problems? I haven't had a chance to check for volts (which now I know the solenoid is getting), the truck is still at a job site.I have the factory wiring diagram book for your truck but it just dont show the fan solinoid very good at all. I was trying to find where the ground wire returned to the ECM. I do know that it gets it's power from fuse #10 in the fuse panel. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49497 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted February 12, 2010 Author Share Posted February 12, 2010 I have the factory wiring diagram book for your truck but it just dont show the fan solinoid very good at all. I was trying to find where the ground wire returned to the ECM. I do know that it gets it's power from fuse #10 in the fuse panel.Your are one helpful man and I appreciate it all. It is definitely a maze of wiring. I would like to have all new wiring and fuse panel someday. There has been to much patch work here and there in my wiring before I got it. I'm pretty sure the coolant steam bath it got has shorted or is shorting something out somewhere. Do you know of anyone that specializes in replacement wiring harness or is this something I'll have to turn to Mack for? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49525 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted February 12, 2010 Share Posted February 12, 2010 Your are one helpful man and I appreciate it all. It is definitely a maze of wiring. I would like to have all new wiring and fuse panel someday. There has been to much patch work here and there in my wiring before I got it. I'm pretty sure the coolant steam bath it got has shorted or is shorting something out somewhere. Do you know of anyone that specializes in replacement wiring harness or is this something I'll have to turn to Mack for?Yes, it's a Mack only item. The good news is the engine harness is pretty simple to install, everything just unplugs. Bad news is sometimes they are on backorder for 3 months or more for older trucks. I'm still looking a better wiring diagram. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49528 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deere Mack Posted February 17, 2010 Author Share Posted February 17, 2010 Finally got back to this project. The low coolant reservoir sensor was the problem with the Engine shutdown and the electrical malfunction lights. Let me say I appreciate everyones help!Now my fan after replacing the solenoid runs continuously. I plumbed it the same way so go figure. At least I don't have buzzers and lights going off and although not economical my fan does work, just all the time. I'll figure it all out one of these days. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/12445-96-ch613-e7-427/#findComment-49905 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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