2003-2005 Macks

[james j neiweem]

It seems that many 2003-2005 macks have more than their fair share of problems. Is there any body not having problems with them.

[hatcity]

I believe "Bigen" isn't having any more with his

[cgallamore]

mine has not give me any problems in 2 weeks. i think you guys helped me figure out the cure for mine. thanks again.

[daveigou]

2003 was the last year for "E-Tech", by then the E-Techs were doing pretty good. 2004 was the first year for "Asset" (EGR), '04's and '05's were trouble. 2004 thru 2007 were Assets, the last ones did better than the early ones. 2008 (EPA 2007) are engines with DPF aftertreatment, the early ones had problems, but the later ones are doing OK. 2011 model year (EPA 2010) are DPF & SCR.

We don't have any of these on the road yet, too soon to tell.

Dave

[cgallamore]

this is just some hillbilly engineering, i'v noticed there is not as much trouble with ch modles and even less in engines other than 460, the vision is the worst, i think the biggest problem is the radiator is to small and the hood is to close to engine,no room for heat to get away, just an opinion.

[cgallamore]

gerryb didnt have any problems with his last week and he put 3,000 miles on it, havn't heard from him this week, hope i didn't jinx him.

[fjh]

gerryb didnt have any problems with his last week and he put 3,000 miles on it, havn't heard from him this week, hope i didn't jinx him.

The lower horse power assets did not give the problems of the 460!seemed the more horsepower you drag out of it the harder it was to keep it together.

[cgallamore]

The lower horse power assets did not give the problems of the 460!seemed the more horsepower you drag out of it the harder it was to keep it together.

not enough water for all them pony,s

[cgallamore]

maybe the 380/410 is a more reliable engine

[cgallamore]

maybe the 380/410 is a more reliable engine

i think i would like my ch better if it had the lower horse power engine, it's all about the reliability

[JerryB]

gerryb didnt have any problems with his last week and he put 3,000 miles on it, havn't heard from him this week, hope i didn't jinx him.

She made up for it this week bigen. She started white smoking about 100 miles from home on the inbound so I pulled the discharge hose from turbo and sure enough the turbo was puking oil. That's the 3rd turbo to go out. The side to side and end play are okay but the seal is out.

[cgallamore]

She made up for it this week bigen. She started white smoking about 100 miles from home on the inbound so I pulled the discharge hose from turbo and sure enough the turbo was puking oil. That's the 3rd turbo to go out. The side to side and end play are okay but the seal is out.

is it still under warrenty?

[JerryB]

is it still under warrenty?

Yessir the turbo is warranted so I may save $3500 or so on this breakdown. Mack warranted the last one after several months and sending it to Memphis for a final exam. I decided I'm going to put a new charge air cooler and all the rubber hose parts this time around. Mack says the air cooler isn't leaking but something is causing the turbo problem. A new cooler is $850 from Detroit radiator but it's $1595 at the local Mack dealer.

[fjh]

Yessir the turbo is warranted so I may save $3500 or so on this breakdown. Mack warranted the last one after several months and sending it to Memphis for a final exam. I decided I'm going to put a new charge air cooler and all the rubber hose parts this time around. Mack says the air cooler isn't leaking but something is causing the turbo problem. A new cooler is $850 from Detroit radiator but it's $1595 at the local Mack dealer.

Jerry

It aint the cooler.

Make sure you got the updated turbo drain tube on your truck there was a SB long time ago on this, see if 68 can find it for you!

Also check to see if he can find the engine data file your running See if its correct we had problems with a few trucks poping turdos the data file was changed to correct the turbo wheel speed !Having said that,

This is where the guessing game starts, running the block off may be spooling the turbo to excess at the wrong times!

Heres a check!When your engine idles just sitting there, What kind of boost do you see on the gauge?

There should be 0-5 at the most!

Don't forget the puter dont know what youve done ,that now is out of its control. neather does the turbo.

im just curious here! Now the turbo has to do what the fuel tells it to do to a point the puter is being told now that the egr valve needs to be wide open Cause its thinking I don't see egr flow. I'm really not sure what its telling the turbo to do at this point!

Just thinking.

[JerryB]

Jerry

It aint the cooler.

Make sure you got the updated turbo drain tube on your truck there was a SB long time ago on this, see if 68 can find it for you!

Also check to see if he can find the engine data file your running See if its correct we had problems with a few trucks poping turdos the data file was changed to correct the turbo wheel speed !Having said that,

This is where the guessing game starts, running the block off may be spooling the turbo to excess at the wrong times!

Heres a check!When your engine idles just sitting there, What kind of boost do you see on the gauge?

There should be 0-5 at the most!

Don't forget the puter dont know what youve done ,that now is out of its control. neather does the turbo.

im just curious here! Now the turbo has to do what the fuel tells it to do to a point the puter is being told now that the egr valve needs to be wide open Cause its thinking I don't see egr flow. I'm really not sure what its telling the turbo to do at this point!

Just thinking.

Thanks for advice on the cooler that saves at least $1000 first. At idle the boost is most times 0 psi but never over about 2psi. Can Mack tell me the engine data file and turbo speed settings you're talking about when I have the new turbo calibrated? Maybe I better take the egr block out and try again. I'll check the oil drain and if you think of anything else I always appreciate your interest and I'm open to suggestion. Thanks for your advice.

[fjh]

Thanks for advice on the cooler that saves at least $1000 first. At idle the boost is most times 0 psi but never over about 2psi. Can Mack tell me the engine data file and turbo speed settings you're talking about when I have the new turbo calibrated? Maybe I better take the egr block out and try again. I'll check the oil drain and if you think of anything else I always appreciate your interest and I'm open to suggestion. Thanks for your advice.

Dont pull the plug your having good sucsess.

OK the boost is correct the key to the turbo speed was that ,The data file is likly correct!The engines started out having almost 10 psi At idle we were poping turbos left and right.

Check the tubo drain thing!The update is some what bigger letting the oil get away faster coolinng the turbo some in therory if recall.

The specs on wheel speed is like pulling teeth to get, Forget that!plus you have to monitor that with the computer program to know whats going on.

This turbo thing may just be the luck of the draw for you i duno. but check on the tube!

Still thinkin!

[Mackpro]

Dont pull the plug your having good sucsess.

OK the boost is correct the key to the turbo speed was that ,The data file is likly correct!The engines started out having almost 10 psi At idle we were poping turbos left and right.

Check the tubo drain thing!The update is some what bigger letting the oil get away faster coolinng the turbo some in therory if recall.

The specs on wheel speed is like pulling teeth to get, Forget that!plus you have to monitor that with the computer program to know whats going on.

This turbo thing may just be the luck of the draw for you i duno. but check on the tube!

Still thinkin!

When the ASET ac first came out the turbo part# started with 631GC5171****, Then after much trouble they redesigned it and the new #starts with a 631GC5176****. Any time the engine came with the 5171 and you changed it to the 5176 stlye the dealer has to call Mack and have the engine software/datafile changed. I think this was only on the 2004 and maybe early 05's. I would have the dealer call and make sure it has the right engine data. The turbo oil drain back tube service bulletin was also only on the 2004's , I will look it up to be sure.

[JerryB]

When the ASET ac first came out the turbo part# started with 631GC5171****, Then after much trouble they redesigned it and the new #starts with a 631GC5176****. Any time the engine came with the 5171 and you changed it to the 5176 stlye the dealer has to call Mack and have the engine software/datafile changed. I think this was only on the 2004 and maybe early 05's. I would have the dealer call and make sure it has the right engine data. The turbo oil drain back tube service bulletin was also only on the 2004's , I will look it up to be sure.

Thanks to both of you. I'll check the drain tube and If it helps thinking mine truck is a 2004 Vision vin# 017436.

[Mackpro]

When the ASET ac first came out the turbo part# started with 631GC5171****, Then after much trouble they redesigned it and the new #starts with a 631GC5176****. Any time the engine came with the 5171 and you changed it to the 5176 stlye the dealer has to call Mack and have the engine software/datafile changed. I think this was only on the 2004 and maybe early 05's. I would have the dealer call and make sure it has the right engine data. The turbo oil drain back tube service bulletin was also only on the 2004's , I will look it up to be sure.

Here is the service bulletin on it.

SB214036

Date: 07/21/05

Model: ASET™ AC

(Not applicable to Mack Trucks Australia)

(Supersedes SB214036 dated 05/05/05)

Turbocharger Oil Drain Tube for ASET™ AC Engines Equipped with Turbocharger Part No. 631GC5176(©M

Effective March 2, 2005, beginning with engine serial No. 5E2939, a revised turbocharger oil drain tube (part No. 681GC544) was implemented into production on all ASET™ AC engines, in conjunction with the production release of the 631GC5176BM turbocharger. The outside diameter of the revised oil drain tube, from the lower end of the bellows to the cylinder block flange, is 1-1/4" (31.75 mm), whereas the outside diameter of the previous drain tube (part No. 681GC538) was 1" (25.4 mm). The larger tube diameter results in improved oil flow and oil drain-back through the turbocharger and drain tube.

Turbocharger Drain Tube Part No. 681GC544

Key

Qty.

Part No.

Description

Replaces

1

1

681GC544

Turbocharger oil drain tube (used with turbocharger part No. 631GC5176[C]M)

681GC538

2

2

189AM3

Nuts, flanged, M10 x 1.50

Pre-March 2004 bolt and Silastic® mounting arrangement

3

1

56AX605

Gasket

4

2

107AM5021

Studs, M10 x 1.50, short end 20 mm, long end 28.5 mm

When replacing an existing 631GC5171(A)M or 631GC5176(A)M turbocharger with a 631GC5176(©M turbocharger, the oil drain tube must also be replaced with the new 681GC544 drain tube. Failure to do so can result in oil leakage at the turbocharger.

If a chassis is being upgraded from a 631GC5171(A)M series turbocharger to a 631GC5176(A)(©M, refer to service bulletin SB214019 for important programming information.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The 631GC5176CM series turbocharger is the only valid replacement for the 631GC5171(A)M and 631GC5176(A)(B)M series turbochargers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When mounting the new drain tube to the engine block, it is recommended to standardize on the stud, gasket and nut mounting arrangement. This mounting arrangement has been used in production since mid-March 2004. Engines manufactured prior to that date used Silastic® instead of a gasket, and bolts instead of studs and nuts to mount the drain tube.

The studs are to be installed with the short threaded-end in the cylinder block. Tighten the mounting nuts to 40 lb-ft (54 N•m).

When using the stud and nut mounting arrangement for the turbocharger oil drain tube on engines having the earlier EGR cooler with the flange connection at the outlet port (part No. 28GB517[A][C]), a spacer (part No. 505GC19P25) is required between the EGR cooler upper forward mount and the cylinder block boss. The spacer is required to compensate for the difference in thickness between the gasket and the Silastic® material.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[fjh]

Here is the service bulletin on it.

SB214036

Date: 07/21/05

Model: ASET™ AC

(Not applicable to Mack Trucks Australia)

(Supersedes SB214036 dated 05/05/05)

Turbocharger Oil Drain Tube for ASET™ AC Engines Equipped with Turbocharger Part No. 631GC5176(©M

Effective March 2, 2005, beginning with engine serial No. 5E2939, a revised turbocharger oil drain tube (part No. 681GC544) was implemented into production on all ASET™ AC engines, in conjunction with the production release of the 631GC5176BM turbocharger. The outside diameter of the revised oil drain tube, from the lower end of the bellows to the cylinder block flange, is 1-1/4" (31.75 mm), whereas the outside diameter of the previous drain tube (part No. 681GC538) was 1" (25.4 mm). The larger tube diameter results in improved oil flow and oil drain-back through the turbocharger and drain tube.

Turbocharger Drain Tube Part No. 681GC544

Key

Qty.

Part No.

Description

Replaces

1

1

681GC544

Turbocharger oil drain tube (used with turbocharger part No. 631GC5176[C]M)

681GC538

2

2

189AM3

Nuts, flanged, M10 x 1.50

Pre-March 2004 bolt and Silastic® mounting arrangement

3

1

56AX605

Gasket

4

2

107AM5021

Studs, M10 x 1.50, short end 20 mm, long end 28.5 mm

When replacing an existing 631GC5171(A)M or 631GC5176(A)M turbocharger with a 631GC5176(©M turbocharger, the oil drain tube must also be replaced with the new 681GC544 drain tube. Failure to do so can result in oil leakage at the turbocharger.

If a chassis is being upgraded from a 631GC5171(A)M series turbocharger to a 631GC5176(A)(©M, refer to service bulletin SB214019 for important programming information.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The 631GC5176CM series turbocharger is the only valid replacement for the 631GC5171(A)M and 631GC5176(A)(B)M series turbochargers.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When mounting the new drain tube to the engine block, it is recommended to standardize on the stud, gasket and nut mounting arrangement. This mounting arrangement has been used in production since mid-March 2004. Engines manufactured prior to that date used Silastic® instead of a gasket, and bolts instead of studs and nuts to mount the drain tube.

The studs are to be installed with the short threaded-end in the cylinder block. Tighten the mounting nuts to 40 lb-ft (54 N•m).

When using the stud and nut mounting arrangement for the turbocharger oil drain tube on engines having the earlier EGR cooler with the flange connection at the outlet port (part No. 28GB517[A][C]), a spacer (part No. 505GC19P25) is required between the EGR cooler upper forward mount and the cylinder block boss. The spacer is required to compensate for the difference in thickness between the gasket and the Silastic® material.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That a boy 68 you the man!

[cgallamore]

Jerry

It aint the cooler.

Make sure you got the updated turbo drain tube on your truck there was a SB long time ago on this, see if 68 can find it for you!

Also check to see if he can find the engine data file your running See if its correct we had problems with a few trucks poping turdos the data file was changed to correct the turbo wheel speed !Having said that,

This is where the guessing game starts, running the block off may be spooling the turbo to excess at the wrong times!

Heres a check!When your engine idles just sitting there, What kind of boost do you see on the gauge?

There should be 0-5 at the most!

Don't forget the puter dont know what youve done ,that now is out of its control. neather does the turbo.

im just curious here! Now the turbo has to do what the fuel tells it to do to a point the puter is being told now that the egr valve needs to be wide open Cause its thinking I don't see egr flow. I'm really not sure what its telling the turbo to do at this point!

Just thinking.

do you think i should go ahead with egr block ????????????????????????????????? ???????

[fjh]

do you think i should go ahead with egr block ????????????????????????????????? ???????

Duno!??? If it aint broke don't fix it for now!We need to get Jerry sorted out first.We'll see if hes got the update drain tube on there!

Your truck will already be fine in this reguard!The chn has everything going for it wide frame yada yada.

As 68 said 2004 was the only year for this!This was one of the first fixes that Volvo came up with.Space shuttle stuff.

[cgallamore]

Jerry

It aint the cooler.

Make sure you got the updated turbo drain tube on your truck there was a SB long time ago on this, see if 68 can find it for you!

Also check to see if he can find the engine data file your running See if its correct we had problems with a few trucks poping turdos the data file was changed to correct the turbo wheel speed !Having said that,

This is where the guessing game starts, running the block off may be spooling the turbo to excess at the wrong times!

Heres a check!When your engine idles just sitting there, What kind of boost do you see on the gauge?

There should be 0-5 at the most!

Don't forget the puter dont know what youve done ,that now is out of its control. neather does the turbo.

im just curious here! Now the turbo has to do what the fuel tells it to do to a point the puter is being told now that the egr valve needs to be wide open Cause its thinking I don't see egr flow. I'm really not sure what its telling the turbo to do at this point!

Just thinking.

this is what i was trying to ask in my EGR AGAIN post but am to dumb to know how to ask it daaa

[cgallamore]

thanks ill just keep my rpm's above 1300, and wait till you get it figured out.

maybe needs a 2002 turbo with the egr block/ sorry test kit???

[cgallamore]

She made up for it this week bigen. She started white smoking about 100 miles from home on the inbound so I pulled the discharge hose from turbo and sure enough the turbo was puking oil. That's the 3rd turbo to go out. The side to side and end play are okay but the seal is out.

let you in on a little secret, that you are very aware of,not to mention the payments are less than the repairs, just the piece of mind being rid of the 04 is worth the payment by itself.

i just hauled my first trip with no repair bills, the chn mite not be as comfortable as the cxn but it's darn close