AC EGR Removal

[frankralston]

[rhasler]

Hello my name is Frank Ralston, and I am new here on bmt.com but I believe I have very valuable information to share. At my shop here in Northwest Indiana, I own 9 trucks, 2 CX, 5 CH, and 2 RD. As everyone knows, only the CX's have problems and it is all due to the EGR. For me at my shop, the cooler break in 5 years I have replaced 10 EGR coolers, and it is getting to be expensive and not worth it at all. OKAY, now for what you guys want to know.

I have an engineering student working for me at my shop and he built the circuit to plug into the little computer behind the EECU, (the EGR Computer)for the EGR mass flow and temperature. The truck succesfully drove for a week without any problems and the EGR codes 5-8 and 5-9 never showed up. For those of you that are trying this method, plugging in the resistors into the back of the EECU, and are having problems I know what your problem is.

The EGR mass flow is what is called a hot wire mass flow sensor, it measure flow by heating up an element like a toaster and as air passes through it it cools down and that is how the computer reads the changes in ohms readings. The EGRMFS runs on AC CURRENT! NOT DC! This sounds bizzare but it is true! The problem you are having with the resistors is probably they are blowing up. We had to use ceramic composite resistors thermally glued down onto a computer heatsink to dissipate the heat properly. The circuit passes so much power to these sensors that the computer side was rated at 250 degrees, taken from an infrared thermometer, and the ground side was reading 550 degrees.

The EGR temperature sensor is very easy, a simple 270 ohm resistor, 1/2 watt resistor worked perfectly.

We are now tapping into the electronic component side of the EGR valve itself, we recently had a cooler fail and it hydrolocked the motor, We are DONE replacing them. Everything will be removed so if anyone has any information on how to trick the computer to think the egr valve is still working operationally please contact me, nancyralston@comcast.net

P.S. I am willing to share any and all information with anyone interested in my circuit designs.

Thanks for reading,

Frank Ralston

Very interesting. I have wondered if it would be possible to plug the port leading to the venturi pipe and weld a new stub onto the mass flow tube which would be redirected back to the exhaust pipe. This would result in flow past the sensor but not back into the engine.

[cgallamore]

looks like mackpro's experiment just got a little easier

[Mackpro]

looks like mackpro's experiment just got a little easier

Yes Finally some one figured it out. I got tired of running to Radio Shack to try different resistors. The weight savings on the engine is close to 70 pounds if all EGR componets and cooling lines are removed!

[Mackpro]

Hello my name is Frank Ralston, and I am new here on bmt.com but I believe I have very valuable information to share. At my shop here in Northwest Indiana, I own 9 trucks, 2 CX, 5 CH, and 2 RD. As everyone knows, only the CX's have problems and it is all due to the EGR. For me at my shop, the cooler break in 5 years I have replaced 10 EGR coolers, and it is getting to be expensive and not worth it at all. OKAY, now for what you guys want to know.

I have an engineering student working for me at my shop and he built the circuit to plug into the little computer behind the EECU, (the EGR Computer)for the EGR mass flow and temperature. The truck succesfully drove for a week without any problems and the EGR codes 5-8 and 5-9 never showed up. For those of you that are trying this method, plugging in the resistors into the back of the EECU, and are having problems I know what your problem is.

The EGR mass flow is what is called a hot wire mass flow sensor, it measure flow by heating up an element like a toaster and as air passes through it it cools down and that is how the computer reads the changes in ohms readings. The EGRMFS runs on AC CURRENT! NOT DC! This sounds bizzare but it is true! The problem you are having with the resistors is probably they are blowing up. We had to use ceramic composite resistors thermally glued down onto a computer heatsink to dissipate the heat properly. The circuit passes so much power to these sensors that the computer side was rated at 250 degrees, taken from an infrared thermometer, and the ground side was reading 550 degrees.

The EGR temperature sensor is very easy, a simple 270 ohm resistor, 1/2 watt resistor worked perfectly.

We are now tapping into the electronic component side of the EGR valve itself, we recently had a cooler fail and it hydrolocked the motor, We are DONE replacing them. Everything will be removed so if anyone has any information on how to trick the computer to think the egr valve is still working operationally please contact me, nancyralston@comcast.net

P.S. I am willing to share any and all information with anyone interested in my circuit designs.

Thanks for reading,

Frank Ralston

I have an EGR valve plunger/diverter break but the electronic actuator was still good. It can easly be removed from the valve and plugged in to the engine harness. The EECU would still think it's there . All it does is open/close to regulate the flow of oil to move the EGR valve plunger/diverter back and forth to let exhaust to the egr cooler. I will try it tommorow.

[fjh]

I have an EGR valve plunger/diverter break but the electronic actuator was still good. It can easly be removed from the valve and plugged in to the engine harness. The EECU would still think it's there . All it does is open/close to regulate the flow of oil to move the EGR valve plunger/diverter back and forth to let exhaust to the egr cooler. I will try it tommorow.

I just can't be bothered removing the stuff ! simply plug the egr with a plate beneath the egr valve and run with it! It seem s to be just fine other than throwing the egr code it does not hinder performance according to the customers that I have helped with this! the big bonus is no more cooler failures no heating and cooling to crack them.

[rhasler]

I just can't be bothered removing the stuff ! simply plug the egr with a plate beneath the egr valve and run with it! It seem s to be just fine other than throwing the egr code it does not hinder performance according to the customers that I have helped with this! the big bonus is no more cooler failures no heating and cooling to crack them.

Plus with the cooler still installed, and no EGR going through it, the cooling system capacity is larger.

[frankralston]

We are still working to completely remove all EGR components, and to remove them with no engine codes is our ultimate goal. That way our drivers will have no false alarm engine codes, that way if there IS a problem they will be more inclined to actually inform the shop mechanics.

We will be posting our results soon, thanks for all the replies!

[JerryB]

Plus with the cooler still installed, and no EGR going through it, the cooling system capacity is larger.

the way I have mine is with a plate like fjh was saying and I don't have a code present. I left the water circulating through it for the extra capacity because I don't like to lower the coolant volume.

[RowdyRebel]

I was searching for something else and came across this. All those seeking to remove EPA required devices should probably read through it...getting caught can be pretty expensive for you. That being said, advertising the fact that you are removing or defeating the devices (or making it obvious that components are missing should the vehicle ever be inspected) on a public message board probably isn't the smartest thing you can do.

http://www.epa.gov/compliance/resources/policies/civil/caa/mobile/vehicleengine-penalty-policy.pdf

Don't get me wrong...if my truck had an unnecessary (government mandated, though not otherwise necessary) component which broke or malfunctioned, and that component was expensive to repair or replace, and I could bypass or remove that component and continue to operate my truck with relative ease....let's just say I wouldn't be spending an arm and a leg making repairs. I may or may not have bypassed required components on 1 or more of my own vehicles. However, when you start bragging about actively getting around the law, you increase your chances of getting caught.

You have 2 trucks with emission components. If they are both 427 HP:

Base per engine penalty = $5/HP. 427 * 5 = $2135. $2135 * 2 trucks = $4270

Next, they determine the level of egregiousness of the violation. Removal of emission components = major.

$4270 * 6.5 adjustment multiplier = $27,755

....and they are just getting started calculating the fine. Bend over and grab your ankles....it ain't gonna be pretty.

You may save weight...but that will work against you when they calculate the fine, too, because that was a "benefit". Saving money on component repair/replacement also counts against you when they determine the fine. Even the size of your business affects the fine.

Read through it. Know the risk if you are caught. If you decide it is worth the risk, do your best not to get caught. The more obvious it is that you defeated the required components, the more likely it will be that you get caught. Remember....these are CMV's, and subject to random inspections on the side of the road. All it takes is one officer poking around under the hood to notice missing emissions equipment and you are up a creek.

Subtlety is key. Don't make it obvious that anything is other than it should be.

[raydurr]

Hello my name is Frank Ralston, and I am new here on bmt.com but I believe I have very valuable information to share. At my shop here in Northwest Indiana, I own 9 trucks, 2 CX, 5 CH, and 2 RD. As everyone knows, only the CX's have problems and it is all due to the EGR. For me at my shop, the cooler break in 5 years I have replaced 10 EGR coolers, and it is getting to be expensive and not worth it at all. OKAY, now for what you guys want to know.

I have an engineering student working for me at my shop and he built the circuit to plug into the little computer behind the EECU, (the EGR Computer)for the EGR mass flow and temperature. The truck succesfully drove for a week without any problems and the EGR codes 5-8 and 5-9 never showed up. For those of you that are trying this method, plugging in the resistors into the back of the EECU, and are having problems I know what your problem is.

The EGR mass flow is what is called a hot wire mass flow sensor, it measure flow by heating up an element like a toaster and as air passes through it it cools down and that is how the computer reads the changes in ohms readings. The EGRMFS runs on AC CURRENT! NOT DC! This sounds bizzare but it is true! The problem you are having with the resistors is probably they are blowing up. We had to use ceramic composite resistors thermally glued down onto a computer heatsink to dissipate the heat properly. The circuit passes so much power to these sensors that the computer side was rated at 250 degrees, taken from an infrared thermometer, and the ground side was reading 550 degrees.

The EGR temperature sensor is very easy, a simple 270 ohm resistor, 1/2 watt resistor worked perfectly.

We are now tapping into the electronic component side of the EGR valve itself, we recently had a cooler fail and it hydrolocked the motor, We are DONE replacing them. Everything will be removed so if anyone has any information on how to trick the computer to think the egr valve is still working operationally please contact me, frankthemackguy@hotmail.com

P.S. I am willing to share any and all information with anyone interested in my circuit designs.

Thanks for reading,

Frank Ralston

[raydurr]

very interesting.So has anyone successfully start to finish eliminated the egr valve or cooler?My 2 CHNs need it done now but dont have the resources to do it without guesswork.anybody can do it on a diesel PU so this should be doable too. thanks

[bulldogmack42]

Has anyone successfully completed the egr delete on the mack ac? My egr cooler is cracked and I am needing to delete it. Thanks for any and all help I have attempted to contact the op but he has been too busy to respond.

[ardakota]

has anyone used the resistor that the post says and has it worked?

 

[Mackpro]

I tried the resistor thing along time ago and could not get it right. I've seen lots of homemade delet's done but still sets the low EGR flow code going down the road. This is the best thing I have seen on the internet so far . https://otrperformance.com/product/mack-aset-ac-egr-performance/

[ardakota]

On 7/16/2017 at 7:52 AM, Mackpro said:

I tried the resistor thing along time ago and could not get it right. I've seen lots of homemade delet's done but still sets the low EGR flow code going down the road. This is the best thing I have seen on the internet so far . https://otrperformance.com/product/mack-aset-ac-egr-performance/

Have you used one before. My flow sender just went out the temp one still is good and they want $1300 for a new one at mack. 

 

[Mackpro]

6 hours ago, ardakota said:

Have you used one before. My flow sender just went out the temp one still is good and they want $1300 for a new one at mack. 

 

I have not seen one installed or know anyone who has used one. 

[dcrow]

I have seen this one too and was considering it as my mass air flow tube was bad. If you get it before I do please report back as to your results. I am just waiting for work to pick back up before I purchase it. Been a little slow the last few weeks.

 

[dirtydog56]

Hello I have a 2007 CTP with a MP7 just replaced the EGR cooler do too leaking # $1400 now my GGR valve is bad no turbo boost is there any plate delete for them thanks Jim.

[ivanuke]

On 7/16/2017 at 7:52 AM, Mackpro said:

I tried the resistor thing along time ago and could not get it right. I've seen lots of homemade delet's done but still sets the low EGR flow code going down the road. This is the best thing I have seen on the internet so far . https://otrperformance.com/product/mack-aset-ac-egr-performance/

Just a wild thought, and In no way am I saying anyone should try this and get into EPA trouble, but wouldnt removing the EGR ECU bus lines VJ3-1E-0.8 and VJ3-2F-0.5 to the EECU and VECU and connecting an j1708 integrated circuit and a little arduino hexadecimal coding magic give the precise "data" the EECU is looking for. Just a thought. The VMAC III Service manual has all the PID data of where one might want to write certain bits of data to.

Edited November 1, 2019 by ivanuke