What A Time It Was... What A Time It Is!

[bullhusk]

What a shame,

We got guys on this site lookin for parts for F Model cabs !!! are you kidding me!!! Mack does not make parts for these trucks any more. What the hell is going on in America today, I remember as a kid (mid 60's) going to Newark NJ Mack with my dad, you could have bought a set of fenders for a Bulldog for God sakes!!! I guess I should start lookin for donor trucks for my R Model's. I don't Know maybe it's just me maybe I'm old school not up with the times? All I know is this, yesterday my Freightliner Rep. informed me that I can not buy any new Glider kits unless I use a engine that meets 2010 em's.so now why even waste your time any more!! We all better wake in this country an soon!! Tell me if I should sign myself in or if some of you guys out there feel the same way as I do

Thank's BULLHUSK

[randyp]

What a shame,

We got guys on this site lookin for parts for F Model cabs !!! are you kidding me!!! Mack does not make parts for these trucks any more. What the hell is going on in America today, I remember as a kid (mid 60's) going to Newark NJ Mack with my dad, you could have bought a set of fenders for a Bulldog for God sakes!!! I guess I should start lookin for donor trucks for my R Model's. I don't Know maybe it's just me maybe I'm old school not up with the times? All I know is this, yesterday my Freightliner Rep. informed me that I can not buy any new Glider kits unless I use a engine that meets 2010 em's.so now why even waste your time any more!! We all better wake in this country an soon!! Tell me if I should sign myself in or if some of you guys out there feel the same way as I do

Thank's BULLHUSK

Keep your hands out of your pockets! I called security and they are on way with net and 12 gauge bean bags,,,nah,,just kidding bullie,,I feel your pain,,agree witcha 100%. hang in there,,,randy-(I dont mean hang in there literally buddy)

[other dog]

Keep your hands out of your pockets! I called security and they are on way with net and 12 gauge bean bags,,,nah,,just kidding bullie,,I feel your pain,,agree witcha 100%. hang in there,,,randy-(I dont mean hang in there literally buddy)

Amen brother! (Bulldog Man)

[vision386]

What a shame,

We got guys on this site lookin for parts for F Model cabs !!! are you kidding me!!! Mack does not make parts for these trucks any more. What the hell is going on in America today, I remember as a kid (mid 60's) going to Newark NJ Mack with my dad, you could have bought a set of fenders for a Bulldog for God sakes!!! I guess I should start lookin for donor trucks for my R Model's. I don't Know maybe it's just me maybe I'm old school not up with the times? All I know is this, yesterday my Freightliner Rep. informed me that I can not buy any new Glider kits unless I use a engine that meets 2010 em's.so now why even waste your time any more!! We all better wake in this country an soon!! Tell me if I should sign myself in or if some of you guys out there feel the same way as I do

Thank's BULLHUSK

Nope,you ain't crazy! we dealt with horner mack down in my area of south jersey for 50 years,i remember you could still buy a complete new cab on a pallet,B,R,F etc. frame rails,fuel tanks,hoods in stock! there attic was a treasure chest in todays market! boxes and boxes of B-model parts trim,chrome,interior parts etc.i think the same way! nowadays unless you want a hat or a mudflap,everything has to be ordered,and half the time when it does come in,its the wrong part,or its mangled beyond recognition! and when i tell you (partsguy) what i want,you should'nt need my VIN# to find a set of floormats or something similar! it aggravates me to no end the way things are done now! the bergey group took over horner right before i moved to VA,i stopped dealing with them alltogether,if you was'nt a waste management truck,or BFI trashtruck,they did'nt have time for you! they told me once it would be 2/3 weeks before they could get me in for a PM for crissakes!...enough is enough!...so if you check in,i'll probly be in the room nextdoor!.........Mark

[bullhusk]

Thanks Guys,

I guess it's not just me,two weeks ago the fan belts came off my (91) CH613 they didn't have them in stock, so they had to Overnight a set in!!! FAN BELTS !!!! But then again like Mark said you look around an you see chrome this & chrome that CB radios 36 in steering wheels mudflaps hats pallets of batteries, and the list goes on. It's not just Mack though, Foley Cat has a three week wait for you to get your truck in for warnt, work (A-CERT) motor.

SO WHAT A TIME IT IS!!! AMEN TA THAT BULLHUSK

[cfesting]

nowadays unless you want a hat or a mudflap,everything has to be ordered

When I lived in TN, it was even worse. I don't remember the details, but they had/have a pretty rough inventory tax for retailers - so nobody would stock much. I think it was applied monthly, and it was pretty high (to make up for having no state income tax, I'm sure). If I was in the Brisol area and needed a part that day, I went north into VA.

[vanscottbuilders]

In a country run by liberals intent on making more new rules than a person can count, it's no wonder that foolish legal stuff like "no glider kits without new engines" gets passed without a care, and forced on us. The only recourse is to vote intelligently - so please do!! Or this foolishness is going to get a lot worse.

Seems crazy that a company like Mack can't stock parts for their older trucks. Especially since they sold you the truck under the auspices that it would last a long time. So, if it's supposed to last a long time - then why can't I buy parts? Guess we need to ask Volvo. Or get American investors to buy Mack. Or do something on our own ....

There might be a market for a small company to remanufacture a truck like the R and DM models. Literally, rebuild it to new specs. Not sure how cost effective it would be, but it might be fun to investigate. The truck would be exempt from new regulations, and would have to meet only those standards in place at the date of its' original manufacture. The R and DM models make a lot of sense, because of their tenure of manufacture, and because of their versatility in the truck industry. There are a lot of them around, and there are still a lot of jobs that an R or DM model Mack could do better than most of its' competitors. So, if a 1970's or 80's Mack DM, say, could be purchased for 65 or 70,000, completely finished to new specs, it would be quite a lot cheaper than a brand new truck; it would be exempt from today's pollution regs, simple to service and maintain, and it would have a life expectancy at least as long as any new truck out there. The big question is - would it sell? Suppose it had a super warranty - say 200,000 miles or five years? Do you think operators would pay that kind of money for a truck that is twenty plus years old?

I don't know if any of this is realistic - but it doesn't take much imagination to picture it.

I could picture building a fleet of trucks for concrete transit companies, or dump truck outfits, or block haulers etc, etc, at a cost far less than comparable new Paccars, Macks, Volvos or Freightliners.

Pretty interesting stuff.

Paul VS

[rhasler]

I don't know if any of this is realistic - but it doesn't take much imagination to picture it.

I could picture building a fleet of trucks for concrete transit companies, or dump truck outfits, or block haulers etc, etc, at a cost far less than comparable new Paccars, Macks, Volvos or Freightliners.

Pretty interesting stuff.

Paul VS

I've had similar thoughts. There was an episode of "Dirty Jobs" where they were refurbishing old US Military tanks because it was cheaper than manufacturing new ones.

[hatcity]

In a country run by liberals intent on making more new rules than a person can count, it's no wonder that foolish legal stuff like "no glider kits without new engines" gets passed without a care, and forced on us. The only recourse is to vote intelligently - so please do!! Or this foolishness is going to get a lot worse.

Seems crazy that a company like Mack can't stock parts for their older trucks. Especially since they sold you the truck under the auspices that it would last a long time. So, if it's supposed to last a long time - then why can't I buy parts? Guess we need to ask Volvo. Or get American investors to buy Mack. Or do something on our own ....

There might be a market for a small company to remanufacture a truck like the R and DM models. Literally, rebuild it to new specs. Not sure how cost effective it would be, but it might be fun to investigate. The truck would be exempt from new regulations, and would have to meet only those standards in place at the date of its' original manufacture. The R and DM models make a lot of sense, because of their tenure of manufacture, and because of their versatility in the truck industry. There are a lot of them around, and there are still a lot of jobs that an R or DM model Mack could do better than most of its' competitors. So, if a 1970's or 80's Mack DM, say, could be purchased for 65 or 70,000, completely finished to new specs, it would be quite a lot cheaper than a brand new truck; it would be exempt from today's pollution regs, simple to service and maintain, and it would have a life expectancy at least as long as any new truck out there. The big question is - would it sell? Suppose it had a super warranty - say 200,000 miles or five years? Do you think operators would pay that kind of money for a truck that is twenty plus years old?

I don't know if any of this is realistic - but it doesn't take much imagination to picture it.

I could picture building a fleet of trucks for concrete transit companies, or dump truck outfits, or block haulers etc, etc, at a cost far less than comparable new Paccars, Macks, Volvos or Freightliners.

Pretty interesting stuff.

Paul VS

In theory-it sounds like a very good idea.

In reality (what all the MBA don't learn) tough call.

Reason- Now adays, boys want MORE POWER, BIG HP

*. 300 horse or less prolly won't move to quick off the lot let alone on the road.

* Most "drivers" now can't shift a plain 5 speed car, now you want to give them 10, 13, 18, TWO sticks

* I don't have a computer to figure out how much I made today let alone tell me whats wrong with the truck

True thing today- went to a seafood festival in town. Order two items 5 tokens and 6 tokens. Little queer (YEAH HE WAS) says 9 tokens, no seven. I gave him 11 and me and the Mrs. walked away shaking our heads.

How difficult would it really be in 5 years to find a true mechanic that understands mechanical engines. I know, so simple but....

[Rob]

Sounds good in theory but if you are using all new components you are essentially building a new truck on "old" technology. No problem with that in anyone's opinion except the government. I think they would force you to meet existing emissions standards for a new product. This would then drive the costs to unprofitability, halting further progression. Now rebuilding an old truck to "as built" specifications, that is a different story. One very well could do that incorporating the latest and greatest technology available at the time, using all new components but it would still be titled/registered as an older truck. I don't know if there is an "experimental, or home built" specification available, but I'm sure the government out of control we have would find a way to tax the efforts, again killing profitability, or prohibiting operation on public thoroughfares.

I do think an old truck could be completely rebuilt to original quality on a production line for something less than 75% the cost of brand new. As many body parts produced overseas that are installed onto american cars, I'm thinking the cabs could be reproduced to original specification. Some of the panels coming from Taiwan are just as good as many produced in this country. Many of the patents that apply to an R model frame for instance most likely have expired, and several competitors could enter the fray to reproduce in the aftermarket. I'd wager that several drivetrain manufacturers would be lining up to sell their wares for such a venture.

Rob

[randyp]

When I lived in TN, it was even worse. I don't remember the details, but they had/have a pretty rough inventory tax for retailers - so nobody would stock much. I think it was applied monthly, and it was pretty high (to make up for having no state income tax, I'm sure). If I was in the Brisol area and needed a part that day, I went north into VA.

Amen to all comments, boils down to if you have several billion dollars and a few lobbyists, you can get any law you want passed or rescinded. Lobbyists are really running this country. randy

[bulldog man]

Amen brother! (Bulldog Man)

I Agree 110% with everyone but esp Paul VS I'll take ANY style of an R Model OR DM Mack over a NEW VOCATIONAL TRUCK ANY Day of the week !! & 2nd this emotion by Tom (other dog) AMEN BROTHER !

Later yall

[storkmack]

All of this stuff is why I am keeping with my 94' RD. Just what would I replace it with? These new trucks with all of their mandated crap scale in heavier than my truck. I can overhaul, rebuild and retrofit alot of stuff on the Rd and be way under what a new Pete with a nap sack(36 inch sleeper)goes for, which is about $127,000.00 The only thing I am having trouble with is making the insdie of the cab quieter. -Brad

[vanscottbuilders]

Brad,

If the noise really bothers you - the next time you plan on doing some fairly major truck work - send me a PM here.

I've had some good success in the B model cabs getting them quieter and cooler. But the interior needs to come completely out of the truck, so there is some time involved. Nothing very complicated - just a pain in the A--.

Paul VS

[convoyduel]

I agree with the sentiment, but the reality is that with the new CARB rules in California, I think there will be a fairly quick adoption of rules by the EPA that compeltely outlaw the use of diesel engines made prior to 1994 for commercial use. I hope I am wrong and I hope that the railroads' recent victory over CARB in the 9th Circuit is quickly applied to trucks as well.

[bullhusk]

I guess I should have Posted " What A time it was... What A time it is. & What A s_ _ _tty time it's going to be!!!!" Well guys it looks like for us truckers, the light at the end of the tunnel is a train!!!

BULLHUSK

[randyp]

I guess I should have Posted " What A time it was... What A time it is. & What A s_ _ _tty time it's going to be!!!!" Well guys it looks like for us truckers, the light at the end of the tunnel is a train!!!

BULLHUSK

I bet its a v*lv* train also, with big horns,,,test dummy randy

[bullhusk]

It's great to see that Mack just got another big build order !! Now maybe thay can start building some parts for older Macks? No.... maybe??

BULLHUSK

[Speed]

I know what you mean about what the dealers stock nowadays. I've been running into the same problem on my ol' Harley;it's a '79 Shovelhead,and the last 4 Harley dealers I've been to had nothing in stock that'd fit it specifically,not even an oil filter! But they'd be GLAD to order parts,if they can find a listing on their computers for 'em. Even the little Mom-n-Pop scooter shops carry precious little for anything that's not an EVO motor or one of the new 120 inchers. Oh,well-screw 'em-I have my own books now,so who needs a shop?

I pestered the Dealer here for a long time to find out why Harley couldn't produce an anniversary model of the '69 Shovel,the '57 Pan,the '47 Knuck,built as original except for better oil system,charging system and brakes. They'd sell faster than they could ever hope to make 'em,regardless of price,but it'd be all us old farts buying 'em,and that'd also mean they'd have to stock OLD PARTS!! (I did find a place that sells a vintage style kit bike that can use all factory parts,but is made with new aftermarket stuff. The main downsides are it can't be titled as a 1947 Harley,it'd be a 2010 Special Construction. Just doesn't sound as cool,and the insurance would be pretty huge. And the price for a do-it-yourself-motorcycle is about $14,000.

I think the restore idea has a lot of merit though. there's a guy in California who goes out across the country buying VW hippie vans and restores and refurbishes 'em,then sells 'em for big bucks,I think I read they were starting at around 15K. Never has a problem getting 'em sold,either.

Would an old restored truck bring on any issues with the DOT or the Commercial insurance carriers?

A guy that used to deliver cheese to the distributor I worked for a long time ago drove a truck he built from a fairly late model(back then)Pete that was rolled,with a Caterpillar yellow B model cab and front group on it,with all the pretty stuff. He said he had a hard time getting any contracts because the clients just couldn't believe a truck that old could be reliable. He finally had to show the title to prove the drivetrain,frame and suspension really wasn't that old,then had to try to prove that NO,it NEVER breaks down. Luckily,he finally got hooked up with this dairy outfit who told him they'd take his word for reliability,and if it started missing runs due to breakdowns,the deal was over. Far as I know,he still runs for 'em.

I went to the local KW dealer looking for an old style clear-with-glitter KW shift Knob for my BroncWorth,and the parts man couldn't even find a mention of it. He didn't even know who MIGHT have 'em. I think his words were something like,"Wow-damn,I can't even remember the last time I had to find parts for a truck that ran THAT kind of transmission!" A couple of days after that,I was helping a friend pull the engine/trans. out of a '48 GMC pick up,and it had just what I wanted in the glove box.

Speed

[bullhusk]

Speed,

I also own nice 361 Brock. I've thrown out the idea on the Brockway Web about getting all the guys making repro grills,fenders an any parts, what ever is out there, and form a web site for one stop shoping!! Well needless to say....I got no feed back none, zilkch, nodda, so like a Gypsy in the night i will prevail.

BULLHUSK

[41chevy]

It's not just Mack or dealers. (Although I had to wait 2 weeks for rocker cover gasket for my DM). It is computers. Parts countermen used to have hands on knowledge of what they sold,most were floor mechanics who moved to the parts room. Now you move from fast food to parts. Add in bean counters who look only at what moves the fastest and that is most of the problem. We had a few real auto part stores here,Napa and Devo both who used not only computers but REAL CATOLOGS!!! Both out of business. I spent the better part of Monday trying to buy a dozen 1/2 i.d. star washers The new parts stores had no idea what it was because it wasn't in the computer (plus I think last week the counter help was working at Mac Donalds) I went to the Mack dealer...after showing what a star washer was.....I heard the phrase " It's not in the computer, whats it for?" "It's for the ground straps on a 1969 Mach DM" "we don't stock any parts for that old a truck" "than look it up for a 2009 Mack." "whats it for?"

Well long story short...I pointed to the Bowmen cabinet and said there are the washers I need on the top rack, I left without them ,I couldn't be billed because they weren't in the computer......... but hey do you want fries with that??

[bullhusk]

41 chevy,

THATS GREAT, funny LOL!!!!! sad but true

Ernie

[Speed]

Reminded me of my favorite parts store,in Stead,North of Reno,where I used to buy a lot of parts,not because of any similarity to that,but more for being the opposite. The owner got so tired of me requesting a part,him trying to look it up but it's too old to be in the 'puter,he finally got to where he'd just say,"Well,you know where the parts books are-come back here and look it up. You can probably track it down faster than I can anyway..." Most everything he normally stocked,he rarely even had to check numbers-he could just walk back to the shelves and pick it for me,and it'd be right! He kept asking me to come to work for him,but I was already working two jobs so I'd just fill in for him a little on weekends sometimes. (He said the only reason he even had the computer was that it was the only way he could track the inventory and automatically reorder parts he sold.

A good parts counter person is the single most important reason I shop a particular parts store;I don't even mind paying more for a part if the person looking it up knows the books,and knows to listen to the customers answers when they ask for more detailed info. I also appreciate when the parts man or woman knows how to work with a non-original,transplanted or "cross-pollinated" vehicle,since probably 98% of everything I've ever owned was a ways from stock or original,often Ranch-Customized,and sometimes it takes a bit of a Detective to figure out what make of car or truck the needed part comes from,since it clearly isn't from the brand of rig it's on.

I often had problems with parts people who thought my 1957 GMC pick up was a Chevy,so the 283 valve cover gaskets the book showed under "Chevrolet and GMC" HAVE to fit my stock GMC 347 Pontiac engine.

Speed

[Lmackattack]

I must be lucky because most of the time at my Mack Dealer..... Northern Il Mack.... I can call and order R model parts and they likely will know the part number and can tell me if its in stock with out having to call me back....

Dan... what law just passed (dident pass) with the railroads?

[Lmackattack]

The only thing I am having trouble with is making the insdie of the cab quieter. -Brad

Brad.. I spent all summer working on the RS cab. I painted the unseen interior parts with a rubber undercoat paint. then put dynamat throughout the whole cab. The cab floor I added dynamat, sound matt, and carpet on top of that. Under the removable floor I put a 2" foam,foil,insulation square. this square is used in gen boxes to keep the engine sounds inside. Fire wall has dynamat,soundmat, and removable Carpet sections that have insulation added. Rear wall has dynamat with 2" insulation between the interior rear wall and steel cab wall. I stuffed 5" of insulation in the cab corners. Roof was the hardest part as there is little room to stuff insulation. The under hood firewall will get some removable 1" foam. I can see it had this from the factory but was long gone before I bought the truck. I also will be adding 1" foam on the under sound of the hood and hood sides. I tested the hood foam and it made a huge diffrence when the hood was closed. Right now the biggest issue is the steering shaft hole in the fire wall and gear levers. those are the w 2 holes that let in the most sound.

with the cab doors closed, windows up, engine fan off, its pretty quiet. If it was a newer electronic engine under the hood it would be just as quiet as a new pete or KW. I was on the phone with a friend and he did not know I was in a truck....

Trent