Mack military

[Lmackattack]

Saw a post on Facebook that Mack was awarded a military contract that extends into 2018... Any truth to that?

[hatcity]

1) It was on the internet, so you know it's true

2) You saw it on FB, so it was from the source

[Joseph Moody Jr]

It was post on www.mackdefense.com

[kscarbel]

Volvo obtained a fixed-price with economic-price-adjustment/indefinite-delivery contract. They did not win a bid (tender) to sell vehicles. A supplier must have obtained this contract in order for the U.S. military to be able to purchase from you, should they decide to do so.

To get in the game, it was necessary for foreign truckmaker Volvo Group to successfully create a shell company in the U.S. that would allow them to sell vehicles to America's military. This is the purpose of the Mack Defense unit (http://www.mackdefense.com/) of Volvo Group Trucks Sales & Marketing Americas.

The entire range of tactical vehicles is from Renault Trucks Defense (http://www.renault-trucks-defense.com/en/range/), now a wholly owned Volvo Group subsidiary (since December 2012).

The U.S. Department of Defense would never walk away from Oshkosh, Navistar or other American suppliers to purchase French military vehicles from a Swedish truckmaker. But with the creation of a shell company called Mack Defense LLC (Limited Liability Company), and the installation of Mack logos onto these foreign trucks, Sweden's Volvo Group then has a much more viable means of selling their foreign vehicles to our nation's armed forces.

The remaining product line-up are just ordinary Mack-badged Volvo civilian commercial trucks (Volvo North American chassis with legacy Mack cabs) sprayed with your choice of beige or olive drab paint (MILCOTS - military commercial off the shelf).

When Mack Trucks was in business, we actually designed and produced purpose-built military vehicles including the NM, NO, NR, M123, M125 and last but not least, the RM-6866RS of the ADF (Australian Defense Force).

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/15604-mack-military-truck/page-2

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/15604-mack-military-truck/page-6

[james j neiweem]

The Military has been buying foreign trucks for a while. The US army had 100's of freightliners.

[rsb502]

The Military has been buying foreign trucks for a while. The US army had 100's of freightliners.

Thousands of Freightliners actually and Freightliner is the US arm of Daimler.

[dagotwit]

Volvo obtained a fixed-price with economic-price-adjustment/indefinite-delivery contract. They did not win a bid (tender) to sell vehicles. A supplier must have obtained this contract in order for the U.S. military to be able to purchase from you, should they decide to do so.

To get in the game, it was necessary for foreign truckmaker Volvo Group to successfully create a shell company in the U.S. that would allow them to sell vehicles to America's military. This is the purpose of the Mack Defense unit (http://www.mackdefense.com/) of Volvo Group Trucks Sales & Marketing Americas.

The entire range of tactical vehicles is from Renault Trucks Defense (http://www.renault-trucks-defense.com/en/range/), now a wholly owned Volvo Group subsidiary (since December 2012).

The U.S. Department of Defense would never walk away from Oshkosh, Navistar or other American suppliers to purchase French military vehicles from a Swedish truckmaker. But with the creation of a shell company called Mack Defense LLC (Limited Liability Company), and the installation of Mack logos onto these foreign trucks, Sweden's Volvo Group then has a much more viable means of selling their foreign vehicles to our nation's armed forces.

The remaining product line-up are just ordinary Mack-badged Volvo civilian commercial trucks (Volvo North American chassis with legacy Mack cabs) sprayed with your choice of beige or olive drab paint (MILCOTS - military commercial off the shelf).

When Mack Trucks was in business, we actually designed and produced purpose-built military vehicles including the NM, NO, NR, M123, M125 and last but not least, the RM-6866RS of the ADF (Australian Defense Force).

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/15604-mack-military-truck/page-2

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/15604-mack-military-truck/page-6

Back in October 2011 I was at the Association of the United States Army (AUSA) annual conference. They had a huge exhibit area, and Mack was one of the exhibitors, selling the militarized Granite. I mentioned the Australian military Macks to one of their reps, and asked him why didn't Mack sell them to the US military. He didn't know they existed.

Edited for sloppy writing and posting.

Edited February 12, 2014 by dagotwit

[kscarbel]

Back in October 2011 I was at the Association of the United States Army (AUSA) annual conference. They had a huge exhibit area, and Mack was one of the exhibitors, selling the militarized Granite. I mentioned the Australian military Macks to him, and asked him why didn't Mack sell them to the US military. He didn't know they existed.

Gee, I'm shocked (sarcasm on my part). The Australian army (ADF) has been running Mack RM-6866RS's from 1981 to the present day (having received several upgrades), and Volvo's people at Mack Defense are clueless. Talk about knowing your business segment and customer base.

Last summer, after 32 years in service ("Built like a Mack Truck"), the ADF reluctantly agreed to source a replacement - MANs (http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/32063-rheinmetall-man-military-vehicles-and-haulmark-trailers-win-158-billion-adf-contract/).

Not knowing that the ADF ran Macks, one can assume the bright and alert Volvo people at Mack Defense didn't know Australia was shopping for new trucks.

[dagotwit]

I am have some friends in the ADF; I will have to ask them their thoughts on the Macks. MAN won a big contract with the British Army several years ago, and New Zealand is looking at MAN.

[Quickfarms]

Do not forget the US Military Mack's

[kscarbel]

Do not forget the US Military Mack'sImageUploadedByTapatalk1392185923.267465.jpg

http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/index.php?/topic/15604-mack-military-truck/page-2

[dagotwit]

Volvo obtained a fixed-price with economic-price-adjustment/indefinite-delivery contract. They did not win a bid (tender) to sell vehicles. A supplier must have obtained this contract in order for the U.S. military to be able to purchase from you, should they decide to do so.

To get in the game, it was necessary for foreign truckmaker Volvo Group to successfully create a shell company in the U.S. that would allow them to sell vehicles to America's military. This is the purpose of the Mack Defense unit (http://www.mackdefense.com/) of Volvo Group Trucks Sales & Marketing Americas.

The entire range of tactical vehicles is from Renault Trucks Defense (http://www.renault-trucks-defense.com/en/range/), now a wholly owned Volvo Group subsidiary (since December 2012).

The U.S. Department of Defense would never walk away from Oshkosh, Navistar or other American suppliers to purchase French military vehicles from a Swedish truckmaker. But with the creation of a shell company called Mack Defense LLC (Limited Liability Company), and the installation of Mack logos onto these foreign trucks, Sweden's Volvo Group then has a much more viable means of selling their foreign vehicles to our nation's armed forces.

Another missed opportunity. The Army's Family of Medium Tactical Vehicles, originally built by BAE Systems and currently being built by Oshkosh, are based on the Austrian Steyr design. How hard would it have been for Mack Defense to offer a license-built version of the Renault or Volvo military trucks?

[kscarbel2]

Another missed opportunity. The Army's Family of Medium Tactical Vehicles, originally built by BAE Systems and currently being built by Oshkosh, are based on the Austrian Steyr design. How hard would it have been for Mack Defense to offer a license-built version of the Renault or Volvo military trucks?

Originally, BAE wasn't in the picture. Houston-based Stewart & Stevenson (better known for producing specialized equipment for the oil and gas industries) won a US government contract to supply FMTVs (family of medium tactical vehicles) in 1998, an Americanized version (Cat 3116, Allison MD3070PT) of the Steyr model 12M18 from Austria.

Armor Holdings bought Stewart & Stevenson's military vehicle division in 2006, and BAE bought Armor Holdings in 2007.

And then Oshkosh won the contract away from BAE in 2011 to build FMTVs, despite never having been involved in its development.

I like Oshkosh. I don't like the FMTV.

For example, the FMTV's Steyr cab, assembled in the US (in order to qualify for the U.S. contract) by McLaughlin Body Company in Moline, Illinois from imported components, is ridiculously expensive.

[dagotwit]

Originally, BAE wasn't in the picture. Houston-based Stewart & Stevenson (better known for producing specialized equipment for the oil and gas industries) won a US government contract to supply FMTVs (family of medium tactical vehicles) in 1998, an Americanized version (Cat 3116, Allison MD3070PT) of the Steyr model 12M18 from Austria.

Armor Holdings bought Stewart & Stevenson's military vehicle division in 2006, and BAE bought Armor Holdings in 2007.

And then Oshkosh won the contract away from BAE in 2011 to build FMTVs, despite never having been involved in its development.

I like Oshkosh. I don't like the FMTV.

The FMTV's Steyr cab, assembled in the US (in order to qualify for the U.S. contract) by McLaughlin Body Company in Moline, Illinois from imported components, is ridiculously expensive.

Thanks for the explanation; I remember when Stewart & Stevenson got the contract and didn't realize all of the changes. IIRC the FMTV had other problems besides costs. This gives an interesting insight into how the Army buys trucks. My impression is that Mack saw an opportunity in the mid-2000s to try and get in to the military market, but they were Johnny-come-latelys and couldn't compete against the Oshkoshes and AM Generals.

[MackMann85]

the last FMTV contract was "build to spec". meaning that if you bid, it was to a predetermined sets of FMTV specs- no submitting your own unique truck allowed. so in essence it boiled down to who could source parts and assemble the cheapest, and who was willing to take the lowest margin.

of course mack military team knows about the RM and business in Australia. basing overall incompetence on the comments of one person makes no sense. who did you talk to? the receptionist? an intern there experiencing a show as a thank you? perhaps a new hire from a month or two ago?

[dagotwit]

of course mack military team knows about the RM and business in Australia. basing overall incompetence on the comments of one person makes no sense. who did you talk to? the receptionist? an intern there experiencing a show as a thank you? perhaps a new hire from a month or two ago?

The person I talked to was a Mack defense employee working Mack's exhibitor booth. Mack military's team may be familiar with their RMs now, but when someone answers your question about why Mack doesn't market the trucks it has building in Australia to the US Military with "I didn't know about that" (to the best of my recollection), then he obviously didn't know they existed.

To be fair to the booth rep, my impression is that Mack's attempts to re-enter the military market are a day late and a dollar short. Mack saw the dollar signs after DoD purchased the Buffalo with Mack components, and the Volvo/Mack management figured they could cash in with a militarized version of the Granite as a COTS sale. Volvo/Mack does not know how to sell to the DoD; the results on Mack Defense's website are proof. Note that back in the the 2000s early 2010s Mack Defense had an office in Alexandria, VA, where I live. I have walked past it many times, it is a small suite. The Alexandria office isn't listed on the website anymore. They did not, and still do not have the sales and lobbying presence needed to compete with Navistar, let alone AM General or Oshkosh.

the last FMTV contract was "build to spec". meaning that if you bid, it was to a predetermined sets of FMTV specs- no submitting your own unique truck allowed. so in essence it boiled down to who could source parts and assemble the cheapest, and who was willing to take the lowest margin.

True, but the Renault/Volvo trucks built for their respective militaries would be built to the same NATO standardization specifications as the Austrian Steyr that the FMTV was based on. It would interesting to know if Renault/Volvo studied the possibility of license building a medium military truck in the USA.

[kscarbel2]

Volvo Suspends Russia Tank Project Over Ukraine Uncertainty

Agence France-Presse / April 7, 2014

STOCKHOLM – Volvo Group said Monday it has suspended a project to build an armored infantry fighting vehicle with a Russian company due to uncertainty over the Ukraine crisis.

Renault Trucks Defense, which is owned by the Swedish truck manufacturer Volvo, in February 2013 signed an agreement to develop a combat vehicle with Russia's state-owned UralVagonZavod.

But the project has been reconsidered due to concerns the Swedish government would veto the deal as the West seeks to isolate Moscow over its annexation of Crimea.

The "Atom" armored infantry fighting vehicle would use a 600 horsepower Volvo D13 engine and so would require approval from Stockholm.

The Atom is a heavy 8x8 infantry fighting vehicle (IFV) jointly developed by the Russian company Petrel (a division of Uralvagonzavod) and Renault Trucks Defense. The Atom is based Renault Trucks Defense’s VBCI (http://www.renault-trucks-defense.eu/Defense/DRIVELINE-VBCI/VBCI).

"As we see many uncertain factors around a possible collaboration, we have suspended our cooperation agreement until further notice," Volvo spokesperson Karin Wik said.

The agreement was meant to last until March 2015, she added.

Sweden is not part of NATO, whose members have yet to block weapons sales to Moscow over its intervention in Ukraine but have suspended military cooperation.

Sweden has been outspoken against Russia's annexation of Crimea.

Swedish daily Dagens Industri wrote last week that Stockholm's "policy is clear: Swedish companies shouldn't furnish the Russian military or defense industry with military equipment that risks being used against Swedish troops."

[kscarbel2]

So at the same time Volvo is attempting to sell military vehicles and components to the United States using their Mack Defense shell company, the Swedish company is also trying to sell to the Russians. That’s slick.

Our boys could be going up against Russian equipment propelled by Volvo engines (produced at Volvo Powertrain in Hagerstown, formerly owned by America’s Mack Trucks).

And Volvo is now reconsidering, not because supplying the Russian military (with modern technology) is the wrong thing to do, but simply because they fear the Swedish government will veto the deal. Talk about corporate ethics.

[MackMann85]

I get the jist from the article that Renault is partnering with the Russian company to build and market these to other countries, not really Russia. I seriously doubt the engine would come from the USA given the export controls we have...I'm sure Volvo has some engine factory in Europe that would do it. At any rate, I'm glad to see the deal is killed myself.