MariStar Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) I have a 2003 Mack RD6, and am having the lifter and cam replaced for the 3rd time in 2 years. Has anyone experienced the same issues? What is causing this? We have regular PMs done. Any input is greatly appreciated! Edited March 10, 2015 by MariStar Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
41180 Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Are you running your Jake brake before the engine is warmed up ? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282150 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariStar Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Don't ever use a Jake brake. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282151 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex g Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Not sure but I was told the reason those lifters failed was a bad batch of them due to incorrect temperature of oven when they were made.I replaced mine and apparently they were a updated batch.Are they replacing all your lifters or only the one that failed. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282162 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariStar Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Wow Alex, that is good to know. It also happened 2 times on my buddy's truck. So are you saying that the lifters that were original to the truck came from a bad batch or the replacement lifters? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenGiant2 Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 it may cost but better to replace them all together with a new cam. Quote We the unwilling, Lead by the unqualified, are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful. Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282165 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex g Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Not sure how long they were bad for that's just a story I was told Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282166 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex g Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 I agree with GreenGiant replace all lifters at once Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282167 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariStar Posted March 10, 2015 Author Share Posted March 10, 2015 Yes, I have had them all replaced, and am having them replaced AGAIN and a 3rd new cam. This is just crazy, not even getting 100,000 miles out of them. I'm wondering now if its a problem with parts or labor or user error. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282169 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex g Posted March 10, 2015 Share Posted March 10, 2015 Can't really see user error is the face coming off your lifters when they fail Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282171 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogg rescue Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Sounds like cam break in trouble. A few years back the EPA had graphite removed, reduced from most oils which aids in metal on metal clearances like cam shafts. There is products available to help break in. Just a thought. 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282178 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogg rescue Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Excuse me, zinc not graphite. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282183 Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_martell Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Is the proper spec oil being used? This is a common problem on certain VW TDI engines (the motor in mine is one), and 90% of the time, incorrect oil is the culprit. My .02 1 Quote Lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part.... Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282188 Share on other sites More sharing options...
41180 Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 I was always told mack cams and lifter problems were traced to not letting the truck warm up long enough before operating it. ,then again we had 2 identical e7 460 's one we had to change cam and lifters 3 times in 10 yes . the other one only once because a eup broke and ruined the can Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282224 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 Is a Mack dealership doing the repair? The "H" ring in the block that holds the lifter could be to high or turned. The dealership should have the tools to check "H" ring alinment. If they are installing ceramic lifter you must have spring loaded push tubes on the exhaust side.Cam break-in.pdfCamshaft.pdf 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282271 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackpro Posted March 11, 2015 Share Posted March 11, 2015 These also might help.H-ring1.pdfH-ring2.pdf Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282272 Share on other sites More sharing options...
turckster Posted March 12, 2015 Share Posted March 12, 2015 After the first replacement cam failed someone should have done a better job of failure analysis, especially if a dealer was doing the work.The only time the lifters should be replaced is on a flat tappet camshaft since the lobe and lifter face have a matching wear pattern. On a roller cam there is no need to replace all the good lifters as long as they are current parts. The camshaft is billet steel and hardened, the roller lifter never develops a pattern on the lobe or the roller. I do prefer to replace all ceramic lifters though because the tiniest imperfection will lead to a failure. That and if you accidentally drop one or it falls out of the bore, i would not trust it after that. That's just me though. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MariStar Posted March 13, 2015 Author Share Posted March 13, 2015 Update! This time, one of the ceramic rollers broke off. The first time we had to replace the lifters and cam, we had the work done at a Bruckner's Mack dealership in Dallas. It took over a month-and-a-half and the work only lasted a couple of months before one of the new Mack screws broke due to being over-tightened-we think.... We took it to our own mechanic the second time due to we didn't want our truck to be out of service another 2 months, and the dealership refused to take any blame for parts or labor. We filled out tons of paperwork and they would not warranty any of the parts even though we returned the parts to them. The rollers that time actually twisted sideways and gouged the cam. This time it seems that the ceramic roller broke, the lifter did not twist and made barely a tiny scuff on the cam that we may be able to have the machine shop buff/polish (interested in your thoughts on this?) We are however going to replace ALL of the lifters. MackPro68 thank you for the service bulletins I am going to make sure my mechanic has a copy! Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282518 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex g Posted March 13, 2015 Share Posted March 13, 2015 I never have but I have seen you can get cams ground I have no opinions on this cause I never tried it but maybe someone on here can enlighten us Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282520 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenGiant2 Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 i had cam craft regrind my cam. Quote We the unwilling, Lead by the unqualified, are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful. Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282532 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRH Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Find a more competent dealer. We roll a cam job in a few days at the worst. The lifter blowing up is usually because someone fucking dropped it and said "oh well".Rollers turning 99% of the time (in my experience) are due to messed up h rings. Make SURE they get inspected and get them fixed. Mackpro beat me to most of the literature.. Face peeling was common with etechs and usually caught early, only result in one lifter getting changed, but the failure inspection is extensive, including h-ring height.. Etc. Catastrophic failures like your last 2 sound like poor workmanship, but you'd have to determine root cause before I'd put it back together.It sounds like the original camjob was a run of the mill failure those engines have, and someone failed to address it correctly. Just my two cents. 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-282776 Share on other sites More sharing options...
turckster Posted March 26, 2015 Share Posted March 26, 2015 Update! This time, one of the ceramic rollers broke off. The first time we had to replace the lifters and cam, we had the work done at a Bruckner's Mack dealership in Dallas. It took over a month-and-a-half and the work only lasted a couple of months before one of the new Mack screws broke due to being over-tightened-we think.... We took it to our own mechanic the second time due to we didn't want our truck to be out of service another 2 months, and the dealership refused to take any blame for parts or labor. We filled out tons of paperwork and they would not warranty any of the parts even though we returned the parts to them. The rollers that time actually twisted sideways and gouged the cam. This time it seems that the ceramic roller broke, the lifter did not twist and made barely a tiny scuff on the cam that we may be able to have the machine shop buff/polish (interested in your thoughts on this?) We are however going to replace ALL of the lifters. MackPro68 thank you for the service bulletins I am going to make sure my mechanic has a copy!I don't mean to start any crap or finger pointing BUT, your biggest mistake was NOT taking it back to the dealership. If I had done the work to this truck and there was a failure, I would want it back untouched for me to determine the failure. If a bolt broke- for example a rocker shaft bolt (powerleash) since they should be replaced when the shaft is removed, then it would be warranty. All damaged components would be replaced at no cost to you. Since you took it to a 3rd party that is not an authorized Mack dealer then I would, like the dealer you mentioned, refuse to look at it and would deny any warranty. I can't think of any other business that would accept that. I know the time frame thing was a factor in your decision, but taking it back to the dealer and pitching a fit or contacting the right people may have remedied that since the repair had failed. But now its just too late. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/39220-replacing-liftercam-for-the-3rd-time-in-2-years/#findComment-284141 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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