Vladislav Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Some while back I found E6-350 factory rebuilt engine with no miles but with rust inside due to the poor storage.Would like to get it back to life and need 6 new 0.20 repair size liners.I checked out local part stores and was offered with PAI ones for $50 each together with shipping and so on.That seemed fair to me.Just wonder how good about quality could they be? Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
david wild Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 We use PAI all the time have had no problems what so ever, doing in frame on N14 right now, all PAI parts. 2 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316711 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladislav Posted December 21, 2015 Author Share Posted December 21, 2015 Thank you for the suggestion David.I just once heard (on here?) than not everything is good with PAI parts and that makes some doubts.Should I hone liners after they're in the block or just put pistons in and follow assembly? Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316714 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranchhopper Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I just put a set of PAI liners in an E6 we use them all the time at work in our fleet. 2 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316722 Share on other sites More sharing options...
david wild Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 I would not hone a new liner ???? 2 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316726 Share on other sites More sharing options...
theakerstwo Posted December 21, 2015 Share Posted December 21, 2015 Do not hone the liners. 2 Quote glenn akers Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladislav Posted December 22, 2015 Author Share Posted December 22, 2015 I checked out E6 overhaul manual and found out I've understood the things a bit wrong.They indeed prescribe to hone liners after pressing them in but to get a slightly "diamond criss-cross pattern surface".I.e. not to correct their shape for the reason of perfection.I just used to suppose that dry, thin walled liners requre shape-in after pressing into a block what means machining and honing.Wet ones are a different story.So Mack E6 surprizes me.My plan is to sandblast and paint the bare block. If I need to hone it I should do it before that.If I can just put liners in at my shop I would paint it first.Thank you for the advices folks. Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316860 Share on other sites More sharing options...
theakerstwo Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 Again do not hone the liners.They have the finish that they need.I think your looking at a very old manual. 1 Quote glenn akers Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316866 Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlotpilot Posted December 22, 2015 Share Posted December 22, 2015 fwiw i would check after installation for any out of round but not hone Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316869 Share on other sites More sharing options...
theakerstwo Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Ant going to do any good checking for out of round cause you cant do nothing about it and on top of that give it maybe 40000 miles and it will seat anyway.I have checked them many times and most all of them are out of round maybe .001 They will be out more than that if you have a main brg cap down.I remember years ago when we use to check the inside of liners on old mack with a inside mic.You could turn it long ways with the block and set it were it would hang in there by its self and reach down with both hands and try to push each side of the block to the center with a slight pressure and the inside mic would fall thru.Those blocks are flexable to some degree.I do remember when you had to hone liners to a fit on the old 673.You put them in with dry ice with a .001 press fit then hone with a drill motor and cant remember but very slow rpm and a 10 grit rock I think.Up and down fast or you would not have a cross hatch pattern. 1 Quote glenn akers Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316894 Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlotpilot Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Ant going to do any good checking for out of round cause you cant do nothing about it and on top of that give it maybe 40000 miles and it will seat anyway.I have checked them many times and most all of them are out of round maybe .001 They will be out more than that if you have a main brg cap down.I remember years ago when we use to check the inside of liners on old mack with a inside mic.You could turn it long ways with the block and set it were it would hang in there by its self and reach down with both hands and try to push each side of the block to the center with a slight pressure and the inside mic would fall thru.Those blocks are flexable to some degree.I do remember when you had to hone liners to a fit on the old 673.You put them in with dry ice with a .001 press fit then hone with a drill motor and cant remember but very slow rpm and a 10 grit rock I think.Up and down fast or you would not have a cross hatch pattern.know where you`re coming from but if you should have one 0.10-0.12 out likely theres a high spot in block that was`nt cleaned up. have seen such on 2 cyls. in same eng. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-316897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladislav Posted December 23, 2015 Author Share Posted December 23, 2015 Too interesting facts, thank you for pointing me out.I sure will check the cylinder geometry after installation, at least to avoid any abnormal issue.The engine I'm going to put my hands on was a factory rebuild unit with machined liner seat holes.The liners (together with pistons) were new there with no miles on.Some stupid guys just layed it on the ground in the yard for some years, probably being headed to scrap it in the end.Some water came in through the injector holes and rotted the liners. Although it was possible to make measurments.I did it and was surprized a bit since the liners were honed up to the upper limit of their size to be machined to.It seemed strange to me, if I hone a block (or do it in a shop) I'd make it about a lower limit or near a middle of a range. Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317076 Share on other sites More sharing options...
41chevy Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 99.9% of all new liners are fully machined and Cross Hatch honed from the manufacturer. Older ones could have needed honing because of the non computerized machining we have now. No matter how good you are, you will not match the "correct" CNC machine and honing processes when the liners are made. When the head is installed and torqued down all the dimensions change. All my cylinder machining and honing on both gas and diesels is done with torque plates installed. Just my pennies worth of input. Paul 2 Quote "OPERTUNITY IS MISSED BY MOST PEOPLE BECAUSE IT IS DRESSED IN OVERALLS AND LOOKS LIKE WORK" Thomas Edison “Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely, in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy shit, what a ride!’” P.T.CHESHIRE Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranchhopper Posted December 23, 2015 Share Posted December 23, 2015 Have fun pulling those liners couldn't get mine out even with the proper tool had to take a torch and heat mine up in a line from bottom to top in three places even then the tool struggled to get them out. Installation was much easier I left them in their boxes and put them all in the freezer for a day they dropped right in like they original equipment. 2 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IH Farms 2 Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 Have fun pulling those liners couldn't get mine out even with the proper tool had to take a torch and heat mine up in a line from bottom to top in three places even then the tool struggled to get them out. Installation was much easier I left them in their boxes and put them all in the freezer for a day they dropped right in like they original equipment.I don't know if you have a mig welder but you can run a bead or two top to bottom instead of using a torch. Have done that on a dry sleeve block I'm sure I'd work on a wet sleeve 2 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317139 Share on other sites More sharing options...
theakerstwo Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 When using a welder just make sure and cover crank.All it would take to wipe a crank out is one dinge berry to fall in oil passage in rod journal. 2 Quote glenn akers Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317149 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ranchhopper Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 I didn't use the welder because of the slag falling down on the crank. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317150 Share on other sites More sharing options...
IH Farms 2 Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 The one we did already had the crank out didn't think of that. Was in a farmall H Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-317155 Share on other sites More sharing options...
scooter Posted January 7, 2016 Share Posted January 7, 2016 I use a 5 gallon bucket of clean solvent and dry ice to put the liners in, and welding gloves , they get cold enough that your skin will stick 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/43191-e6-cylinder-liners-made-by-pai/#findComment-318980 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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