mholm Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 1962 Mack B85F Fire Truck, when in gear not engaging rear drive shaft. Can shift through gears and feel the gears turning. Driveshaft from main transmission to the pump transmission spinning when in gear and neutral (stops when clutch engaged), but no movement on rear driveshaft from pump transmission to rear axle. Have toggled switch for pump, hear the click but not sure if that's the issue. Or possibly hand brake behind pump transmission might be culprit. Looking for any ideas on where to start. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
609albert Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 standard trans.right? check hand brake released and not stuck .does it have a electric switch to engage pump or a manual lever? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post VALS327 Posted May 7, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted May 7, 2016 Hello, . If the front drive shaft is spinning and the rear drive shaft is not spinning then your transfer case is not in the road position. The transfer case is either in pump or floating between road and pump. If the hand brake was the issue you would feel and hear the motor when it tried to over come the hand brake. My first question would be do have any children that go near the truck when your not around. There should be two levers. One on the pump panel and the other below the pump panel on the drivers side. These levers alow you to manually put the truck from road to pump and then back. The lower lever moves a shaft downward which allows you to use the upper lever to put the truck into pump or back to road. The lower lever needs to be put back so the shaft can go back up and locks into the metal piece the upper lever connects to. If it does not lock in the the transfer case can slip out of road position and float between road and pump. I was at a show once and spectator manually put my truck in pump. Assumed it was a kid because they touch everything. To check the electric pump shift motor, with the truck off and the batteries on flip or have someone flip the switch in the cab. You will be able to hear the two speed pump shift motor operate. I hope I was able to help. Keep us posted on how you make out. Don 3 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332551 Share on other sites More sharing options...
1958 F.W.D. Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 VALS327 hit it all. 1 Quote TWO STROKES ARE FOR GARDEN TOOLS Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332552 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 (edited) What VALS327 said and don't do it with the truck in road gear while you try the manual override. It should be running at idle in neutral. If it won't shift you may need to put it gear, let the clutch out briefly, and then return to neutral before re-trying the manual override. I have also had cases where the manual override was frozen from lack of use. If it acts like it is stuck a couple of smacks with a hammer will usually free it up. Edited May 7, 2016 by fxfymn 1 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332557 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 7, 2016 Author Share Posted May 7, 2016 Thanks for the responses, been a great help but still not moving. Kids all around it so very well could have been the overide, but either way I'm not getting it in drive gear it seems. Can feel it going into gear and front driveshaft stops in idle but still can't get truck to move. Hit in with hammer to make sure in, again same. Seems stuck between road and pump maybe? Tried toggling electric switch in cab and overide to see if I can get a response but same. The overide does seem to be moving an arm on the transfer case, so possibly an internal issue with the transfer case? I did let out the clutch in gear with parking break on for a split second last time I parked it. Could I have busted something in the transfer case? Also I just have the electric switch in cab and the overide lever just below and to the right of the pump panel. Couldn't find a 2nd lever that is connected? Is there more to the switch between drive and pump than the arm on top of the transfer case? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332578 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Have a friend hit the switch while you watch the levers to see if they move. I doubt that letting the clutch out with the parking brake on would do any damage. Is the pump turning? 1 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332640 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 8, 2016 Author Share Posted May 8, 2016 Levers do move, turns an arm on top of transfer case. When truck is running and in neutral I pushed lever in and can feel gears slowing down then lock in. Front driveshaft stops like it's in drive but then truck still not moving. I have a buddy coming by on Monday to help me look at driveshafts while truck is in gear. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 8, 2016 Author Share Posted May 8, 2016 Pump is turning Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 8, 2016 Share Posted May 8, 2016 Have you checked for metal chunks in the transfer case oil? 1 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-332678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 18, 2016 Author Share Posted May 18, 2016 Broken pump trans output shaft. Waterous unfortunately doesn't have the part nor cast to make one. Have specs and part # 70375. Anyone have any idea to try to track one down or s machine shop that could make one? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333742 Share on other sites More sharing options...
VALS327 Posted May 18, 2016 Share Posted May 18, 2016 (edited) Hello that sucks, Its a long shot by there was a guy recently who posted his B model tractor he converted from a fire engine. His handle is ttttrucks. Try to reach out to him and hopefully he has not scrapped the transfer case yet. Other then that put the word out and Google search. I'm sure there a dusty one sitting on a shelf some where. Temporary fix to allow you to drive the rig and enjoy it would be remove transfer case and install a longer drive shaft. Good luck, Don Edited May 18, 2016 by VALS327 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333748 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 First shot would be Cal Little. It shouldn't be hard to find another transfer case. Remember it was probably used in many trucks, not just Macks. Try advertising on SPAAMFAA's web site as well. 2 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333817 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 19, 2016 Author Share Posted May 19, 2016 very common in Pierce as well from what I hear, but about 30 calls & emails in, no luck yet. Have a few gear manufactures quoting as well. Who is Cal Little though? Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333828 Share on other sites More sharing options...
41chevy Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 18 hours ago, VALS327 said: Hello that sucks, Its a long shot by there was a guy recently who posted his B model tractor he converted from a fire engine. His handle is ttttrucks. Try to reach out to him and hopefully he has not scrapped the transfer case yet. Other then that put the word out and Google search. I'm sure there a dusty one sitting on a shelf some where. Temporary fix to allow you to drive the rig and enjoy it would be remove transfer case and install a longer drive shaft. Good luck, Don Here is the thread worth a shot. http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/44677-b-mack-fire-truck-turned-into-cool-truck/#comment-329656 1 Quote "OPERTUNITY IS MISSED BY MOST PEOPLE BECAUSE IT IS DRESSED IN OVERALLS AND LOOKS LIKE WORK" Thomas Edison “Life’s journey is not to arrive at the grave safely, in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘Holy shit, what a ride!’” P.T.CHESHIRE Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333834 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 19, 2016 Author Share Posted May 19, 2016 Thanks, I sent ttttrucks a message yesterday, but can't hurt to post on the thread as well 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333844 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loadstar Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 There's a guy on eBay in North Carolina selling a windshield off of a B model fire truck.....pictures show the whole truck.... Might be worth a shot.... 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333849 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 19, 2016 Share Posted May 19, 2016 Cal Little in PA; Pine Hill Restorations; He has slowed down a lot, but he had a pretty good selection of used Mack parts. 717-566-8973. http://www.bigmacktrucks.com/MusicVid/partssupplierslisting.pdf 2 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333854 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 20, 2016 Share Posted May 20, 2016 You might also try D&D Truck Repair and Towing, Hagerstown, MD. Dave has converted a Type 75 and may have a transfer case. He also has several Mack fire trucks in his yard that are being parted out. 1 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-333936 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 24, 2016 Author Share Posted May 24, 2016 Thought I'd provide an update. Tracked down a few Macks with pumps, one from ebay winshield rig, two from D&D ('55, '64 & a '65) also talked to Cal Little and several others. Nothing short of great people all trying to help but unfortunately no match. Haven't heard back from ttttrucks, even tried dialing a Canada # from a post of his but not him. Also still trying to get in touch with the '61 Mack on ebay but won't return calls. Waiting on several custom gear manufactures for quotes, only one I got back wants $8k. Appreciate all the advice, we'll see what happens but looking like I might have to bypass pump and go with a custom driveshaft to at least get back on the road. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 24, 2016 Share Posted May 24, 2016 The other option would be to change the pump along with the transfer case. If the transfer case is not integral to the pump you may be able to just go with a different transfer case. 2 Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmerrill0516 Posted May 26, 2016 Share Posted May 26, 2016 On 5/24/2016 at 10:29 PM, mholm said: Thought I'd provide an update. Tracked down a few Macks with pumps, one from ebay winshield rig, two from D&D ('55, '64 & a '65) also talked to Cal Little and several others. Nothing short of great people all trying to help but unfortunately no match. Haven't heard back from ttttrucks, even tried dialing a Canada # from a post of his but not him. Also still trying to get in touch with the '61 Mack on ebay but won't return calls. Waiting on several custom gear manufactures for quotes, only one I got back wants $8k. Appreciate all the advice, we'll see what happens but looking like I might have to bypass pump and go with a custom driveshaft to at least get back on the road. If all else fails and you have the original, contact a Motion Industries sales guy. I know a dam good one if you can't find one who wants to help. They can contact Martin Gear (Texas I believe). They can make anything gear related and are VERY reasonable in my experience. I'm assuming it is shaft with a gear on it...if it's just a spline shaft, any good shop should be able to help. Post a picture of the culprit if you can. 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334591 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 27, 2016 Author Share Posted May 27, 2016 See attached specs from Waterous. Yeah, shaft / gear, the one of the truck is all twisted and broken up. Finally found a machine shop to do it for $1300 but they need 8 weeks.... Another said they'd do it in a week, for $14,000, that one was a good laugh. Closest pump / transfer case I found several hundred miles away and a whole lot of uncertainty. Still goose chasing while trying to figure out if I can just run a small custom drive shaft temporarily to swap out later. Waterous 70375.pdf Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334620 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mholm Posted May 27, 2016 Author Share Posted May 27, 2016 This is what it looks like, for sale on ebay, just not the right one Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334621 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fxfymn Posted May 27, 2016 Share Posted May 27, 2016 Quote the one of the truck is all twisted and broken up. Before you put another shaft in you need to find out why this happened as this is almost unheard of. Did you try to engage the pump at high speed by mistake? Was the pump frozen? A seized bearing? A broken shaft that is twisted and broken is probably a symptom of an issue, not the cause. Quote Money, sex, and fire; everybody thinks everyone else is getting more than they are! Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/45111-in-gear-but-rear-driveshaft-not-spinning/#findComment-334683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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