Should VW buy Mack?

[TeamsterGrrrl]

OK, so Volvo isn't hanging around bankruptcy court yet, but they could use some cash. And while VW has bought a couple of the best with MAN and Scania, and maybe International too... They still need a conventional cab truck with a good reputation. So would VW buying Mack make sense?

The Pros: The legendary Mack V8, now in Scania custody, would be awesome in the Titan. Scania's 13 liter SCR only 6 gets 10 MPG in their old cabover... In a Pinnacle It'd beat the heck out of Freightshaker's latest "Evo" Cascadia.  And out of Volvo's shadow, Mack would be free to compete with no worries of upstaging Volvo's pathetic offerings.

The Cons: There ain't much left of Mack to save- Volvo has thoroughly "tagged" the powertrain plant as their's, and most of the chassis is Volvo with some Mack fixes. About all Scania would get would be the aging conventional cab and the MR and LE, which are even older but the customers seem to like that.

What's your opinion...?

[theakerstwo]

Don't give them any ideas.

[james j neiweem]

Scania and Mack have a long history. It would be nice to keep it going. I can't see how VW would get entry into the US market. All of the Volvo/Mack outlets would probably be kept by Volvo. May bee they could use the Navistar outlets.  It would be nice if Mack had some autonomy.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Might make sense to sell the vans, pickups, and SUVs as VWs and/or Internationals, but for heavy trucks Mack and International should be the only brands used. Would make sense to market International as the value brand and Mack as the premium brand, and focus Mack more on heavy trucks and International on mediums. The dealerships are a problem, thanks to Volvo's dualing most of the Mack dealerships with Volvo. There's also the problem of supplying Volvo "legacy" parts, as Volvo has corrupted Mack with their engines and more for over a decade now.

Then again, I bet a lot of Mack marketing people and dealers would love to be rid of Volvo's muzzles!  

[DailyDiesel]

I have to think VW has found it's US partner in International.

International has a full spectrum of trucks from light to heavy and a large dealer and parts network. No need to reinvent the wheel as they say.

[Mackpro]

I'd rather have Hino. Let the Japanese have a shot at it. I'm done with that other side of the globe!

[Timmyb]

If another company were to buy Mack, I think they would have to give it number one priority. VW have several others brands, and I wonder if Mack would get the attention it needed. 

[philatruck]

I do not think VW should buy Mack. VW has screwed enough things up, and I would think they would kill the Mack Brand. I would rather see a company such as Oshkosh buy Mack. Here are my reasons,

Pros: 

• Oshkosh is really good at growing their brands that they have acquired.
• Since Oshkosh owns other brands such as McNeilus, IMT, Jerr-Dan, and Pierce, they can make fully equipped vocational trucks direct from the factory by streamlining the body building process.
• McNeilus, an Oshkosh Brand makes natural gas powered systems for trucks, that could introduce this technology in Mack Trucks. This would be very beneficial in the cabover vocational market since the majority of new refuse trucks ordered are natural gas powered.
• Oshkosh is already known for making durable and tough products so they would be very good at continuing the Mack Bulldog tough tradition, and slogan.
• May Cross Mack and Oshkosh products to create new product lines, especially in the municipal, construction, waste,and fire/rescue vocations.

Cons:

• May Discontinue Mack/Volvo Engines and Components, and go the Cummins Route. May be a pro because It may attract fleets that run all Cummins products.
• May Integrate Mack Defense products with Oshkosh Defense products since they are already heavily involved in government contracts

[Swishy]

Just cut to the chase

Mack/Caterpillar

WotSezU?

cya

§wishy

[james j neiweem]

Mack/Oskosh-Would have to establish coast to coast outlets

Mack/Cat-They just dumped the engine and truck business

Mack/Deere-Have Tier III engines and a dealer network

Mack/Ford-Dealer network and ford could get back in with the big boys

Mack/GM-same as Ford

Mack/Paccar-Too much overlap of models

Mack/Navistar-Model overlap but could follow the Paccar model

Mack/Volvo-Mack needs more independence

[57 bcr]

On the lighter side.If  VW did buy MACK, they could be re-engineered to run great and smoke again............until caught!      Al  

[Vladislav]

8 hours ago, 57 bcr said:

On the lighter side.If  VW did buy MACK, they could be re-engineered to run great and smoke again............until caught!      Al  

This worth the "Best answer" award!

[Bullheaded]

Wow, good to see the forum hasn't changed. Still bitching about Volvo.

Guess you still haven't figured out Volvo/Mack is the better choice of ALL the new junk that is available today.

Want something to really bitch about......buy a new Western Star or Cummins and see what happens to your bank account. Hahahaha.

[41180]

Amen to that 99 percent of the people on this forum won't talk to me because I don't hate volvo . I comment on a thread and the thread stops lol

[kscarbel2]

3 hours ago, Bullheaded said:

Wow, good to see the forum hasn't changed. Still bitching about Volvo.

Guess you still haven't figured out Volvo/Mack is the better choice of ALL the new junk that is available today.

Want something to really bitch about......buy a new Western Star or Cummins and see what happens to your bank account. Hahahaha.

A gentleman opened a thread to discuss the topic "Should VW buy Mack?"

You posted that he and the fellow BMT members who entered into an intelligent discussion with him were "b*tching about Volvo".

Now, why would you do that? If the thread doesn't interest you, or annoys you, simply exercise your freedom to skip the thread and move on. 

Why bash these people, your fellow BMT members? Prior to your post, had any one of these people sent you a PM ridiculing you?

I always strive to respect your thoughts. Like all BMT members, you have in the past brought great points into many a discussion.

However, today, I struggle to understand why you would attack your fellow BMT members. Getting along with people begins with mutual respect and consideration. I myself am FAR from perfect, but I always strive to express my thoughts on BMT in a respectable and considerate manner. 

[kscarbel2]

1 hour ago, logtruckman said:

Amen to that 99 percent of the people on this forum won't talk to me because I don't hate volvo . I comment on a thread and the thread stops lol

Whether you like or hate Volvo and scrapple, I'll still give you a hug.

Now, if you don't like Yuengling Black & Tan, perogies and Heavenly Hash ice cream, I might not.

[Phase 1]

5 hours ago, logtruckman said:

Amen to that 99 percent of the people on this forum won't talk to me because I don't hate volvo . I comment on a thread and the thread stops lol

 

The curse has been broken! The thread continues !

[Timmyb]

You guys are looking at it wrong. This site isn't about our hate for Volvo, it's for our love of Macks. 

 

 

[james j neiweem]

Timmy B Great comment. Come on Log Trucker, we still like you.

[Bullheaded]

8 hours ago, kscarbel2 said:

A gentleman opened a thread to discuss the topic "Should VW buy Mack?"

You posted that he and the fellow BMT members who entered into an intelligent discussion with him were "b*tching about Volvo".

Now, why would you do that? If the thread doesn't interest you, or annoys you, simply exercise your freedom to skip the thread and move on. 

Why bash these people, your fellow BMT members? Prior to your post, had any one of these people sent you a PM ridiculing you?

I always strive to respect your thoughts. Like all BMT members, you have in the past brought great points into many a discussion.

However, today, I struggle to understand why you would attack your fellow BMT members. Getting along with people begins with mutual respect and consideration. I myself am FAR from perfect, but I always strive to express my thoughts on BMT in a respectable and considerate manner. 

Well here's one quote: Volvo has corrupted Mack with their engines and other stuff for years now.

I would call that bashing no? Everyone else gives their "opinnions" so I can too. And if you don't like mine, don't read them.

[kscarbel2]

9 hours ago, Bullheaded said:

Well here's one quote: Volvo has corrupted Mack with their engines and other stuff for years now.

I would call that bashing no? Everyone else gives their "opinnions" so I can too. And if you don't like mine, don't read them.

My friend, we all enjoy hearing your opinions.

What the gentleman actually wrote is:

"There's also the problem of supplying Volvo "legacy" parts, as Volvo has corrupted Mack with their engines and more for over a decade now."

Most folks agree there's a big difference between some people have a clean, constructive and intelligent conversation, .......and bashing.

Please step back, take a deep breath and reread the posts. There's no Volvo bashing above, rather, just some thoughts related to a financially-challenged Volvo now selling off many assets. Mack could easily be next.

If you are thrilled to death with your Mack-badged Volvo trucks, I think that's great. If you're happy, I'm happy. And if you're that pleased with Volvo engineering, i.e. the better choice as you put it, you can simply buy a Volvo the next time around.

I don't care for Cummins myself, aside from the Cummins-Scania XPI common rail fuel injection. I don't care for Western Star's direction in the US market, but they sell a superb product in Australia and New Zealand. As many fleet managers will tell you, and our own Bullhusk (Ernie), the Detroit engines are arguably the best powerplants currently available in the North American market. I myself wouldn't touch a Volvo engine, one reason being the Delphi fuel injection and its related problems.

 

 

[Bullheaded]

Ya I know. I won't win this argument. Everyone is stuck in the past. The Mack of old was king. No doubt about it. But compared to todays trucks and engines, I don't understand why everyone keeps bashing Volvo.

My 2000 E7 was far from reliable and most were problematic until the MP series came along. Volvo also has supplied them with the best automated manual on the market.

You're right too.....I'd also be happy with a Volvo. My friends have them and they have been bulletproof. But I don't get along with the local dealer, so until I change brands again I'm stuck with problematic Western Star and Cummins products, and Detroits that have constant regen issues when loaded light. Surprisingly though the Mexican built Freightliner 122SD's have better build quality than the Portland Star's.

And for Logtruckman I can report two of my friends have Titan self loader log trucks with 605 MP10's also and they pull like trains and have had no issues other than the stainless peeling on the grills and breathers.

[kscarbel2]

You speak of regen issues...........

I want to take this opportunity to share something. The trucks in Europe, from DAF to Mercedes-Benz, are not having any of the problems that some U.S. operators are experiencing. Trucks can and do break, but generally they're not having these problems.

Why? The US truck is priced cheaper than the European truck. There's typically a 4 year lag before the US market receives new technology from Europe. And when they do, here's the nutshell, they have to reinvent it in a cheaper (lower cost) form to match up with the cheaper U.S. truck price.

In summary, the U.S. market truck price is lower than Europe. The cost of all parts/components has to be tallied with still some room for profit (margin), while remaining in the competitive range. Since the US truck sells for less, either leading edge global truck technology doesn't come to the US market at all, it is delayed 3-5 years, or it arrives in a lower cost form that isn't as reliable as the European market version.

 

[TeamsterGrrrl]

I agree, the U.S. truck market is oddball and cheap to boot, so we get stuck with the leftover and cast off technologies. Never seems to amaze me how companies will buy the cheapest truck when they're going to spend over a million dollars on repairs, fuel, and driver wages during the truck's lifetime.

[BillyT]

Bickering  among ourselves is not constructive,so I will change the subject to something that affects us all! Car and Driver had an article on the recent escalation of accidents involving heavy trucks which pictured  a semi plowing into a group of hapless four wheelers, and a terrified lady motorist viewing the carnage! I expected a slanted column bashing truckers,but the article was pretty " balanced". They touched on the usual stuff, hours of service, fatigue and the NHTSA ( no hope truckers stop asking) and ATA (anti truck driver association) and their advocacy for a lower truck speed limit and truck governors etc. Now there's a couple of fresh concepts! I'd like some of your views, particularly on truck driver training schools and new driver competency! They did allude to the lack of "active suspension" on big trucks,an experienced driver doesn't need this expensive nonsense!