Trump and Immigration (Illegal Immigrants in the US)

[kscarbel2]

45 minutes ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Y'll forgot that immigration is governed by federal law, which means the federal government has responsibility for enforcing it. City, county, and state attorneys do not prosecute federal cases, the U.S. Attorneys do. Same with enforcement, ICE is the federal law enforcement unit that handles immigration. As for my fellow council members and mayor ordering that our police enforce immigration laws, like most small towns we have no police force and delegate that responsibility to our county sheriff. He has more important things to do that chase down undocumented immigrants for ICE. 

So you might want to study up a bit on the separation of power between the federal and lower levels of government before you suggest we locals usurp the fed's responsibility.

Yes, of course you are quite right.

However, I feel that our local, state and federal authorities are all on the same team......the American team.

And you see that, from Oklahoma City to 911. Inherently by the woven fabric of our government, they must and do work together.

[Truck Shop]

I don't normally enter political discussions, but has anyone read the books Fahrenheit 451 or Berlin Diary? 

Truck Shop

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Yes, we're on the same team- That's why we respect the federal governments role and don't try to usurp ICE's duties.

[HeavyGunner]

1 hour ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Y'll forgot that immigration is governed by federal law, which means the federal government has responsibility for enforcing it. City, county, and state attorneys do not prosecute federal cases, the U.S. Attorneys do. Same with enforcement, ICE is the federal law enforcement unit that handles immigration. As for my fellow council members and mayor ordering that our police enforce immigration laws, like most small towns we have no police force and delegate that responsibility to our county sheriff. He has more important things to do that chase down undocumented immigrants for ICE. 

So you might want to study up a bit on the separation of power between the federal and lower levels of government before you suggest we locals usurp the fed's responsibility.

No, I didn't forget immigration is governed by the Feds. That's why I pointed out how shameful these clowns running these sanctuary cities making a point to come out and literally say we will not help or comply in any way.  It takes no more effort to detain a legal citizen than an illegal. The difference is, we can send the latter home if these boneheads cooperate. That's probably not good for their reelection which is likely a big part of why they don't comply. Same reason they are against state ID required to vote. We can stop this illegal border jumping, but EVERYONE needs to play their part to make it happen.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Those cities are just proclaiming what every city is doing... Leaving immigration enforcement to the feds. Heck, if our council decided to enforce immigration laws, where would we even start?

[gearhead204]

10 hours ago, BillyT said:

GH 204, thank you for your clarification on the wage rate! I was ready to rent a van, fill it with workers and head to Washington as a labor contractor! We all tend to only see one facet of anothers life and judge them by that! There has been for decades in Florida a situation that heavily favors businesses over workers in every pursuit including agriculture. The enslavement I referred to was actual locked gate captivity, with the labor contractors raping the women and taking an unfair percentage of the workers already low wages! The minimum wage in Florida is around 8.00. I just naturally assumed the crops you were harvesting were high dollar like the cherries you mentioned,down here it is blueberries and strawberries. The citrus crop is down to 20 percent of previous years due to "citrus greening" a disease that kills orange trees! The researchers at UF are feverishly working to find a cure if they don't the majority of our orange juice will come from Chile and central America! A lot of it already is! I am familiar with the H2A program. The computer industry is replacing American workers with people from India under that program, and forcing the displaced workers to train them or they won't get their severance package! How the hell can you afford to transport workers to and from Mexico from Washington! It is obvious there is no one answer to the problems we face! It is also obvious we cannot continue continue to keep feeding,housing, and educating non citizens forever,would they do the same for us if we illegally crossed into Mexico?!

The transportation of workers north is a challenge! I am trying to figure out how to afford several H2A workers for this next year as well as housing for them.

I am too small of a farmer for the H2A to be a good fit (only 30 acres of fruit), so to make it work, I need to team up with a few other farmers and share the guys! But the thought of bad weather causing a severe crop loss and being stuck paying the contract balance scares the crap out of me! But labor is getting harder and harder to secure when needed. The new generation doesn't want anything to do with playing in the dirt or climbing a ladder, and only want to work 4 or 5 days a week. I guess when I was that age, I liked to have some money in my pocket, so 7 days a week of work was great, I didn't have time to spend it and was saving for collage or the tool box!

I sure hope FU finds the answer to citrus greening , those tree viruses' are EXPENSIVE to deal with, we have one called little cherry disease and if you are late to find it when it strikes it will cost you the whole block! I'm in the process of prepping ground now that was Rainer and Regina cherry's for new Premier Honey Crisp trees that I will plant in April of 17 , its a rock pile that I'm getting tired of looking at ( about 50 cy. per acre of rock) hoping to finish that by the weekend (the cherries I pulled didn't have the virus, just no longer profitable).

[HeavyGunner]

17 hours ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Those cities are just proclaiming what every city is doing... Leaving immigration enforcement to the feds. Heck, if our council decided to enforce immigration laws, where would we even start?

No those mayors said we will not help in any way, shape or form. Again there are things they could do to help rather than welcome people who are here illegally to come stay in their city on the taxpayers dime. They could say although we can't afford to go at this illegal alien problem alone we will work hand in hand with the Feds to help in anyway possible. If we happen to pull someone over for speeding and find they are here illegally we will turn them over to whatever federal agency that is dealing with this. How hard is that?  How about for a start the mayors say we will not purposely go out of our way to harbor illegal aliens?  How about not giving them state ID's like diblasio did? Or how about the city council gets together with the mayor and makes steep fines for businesses caught knowingly and purposely hiring illegals?  Those aren't that expensive, hard or abstract ideas to implement. 

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Obviously you weren't paying attention during Civics class... Cities do not issue driver's licenses and ID cards to the public. neither do cities usurp the work of federal agencies like ICE. As for checking for legal residence on traffic stops, that takes officers away from more serious crime solving. And if a database check shows an actual want by ICE (ICE has know idea who just wandered across the border that they haven't caught yet), then we have to transport, process, and jail them at our cost,for however long it takes ICE to have a bus nearby to pick them up. And if ICE doesn't take them, the arrestee can turn around and sue us. As far as fining local businesses for violating federal laws, we have no authority to do that.

And again, for these practical reasons, most every city is a de-facto "sanctuary city". You expect us to enforce federal misdemeanor law when the federal government gives us no resources to do so? County I'm in today has a population of around 5000 and maybe a dozen deputies and town cops in the whole county, which means at night there's maybe only an officer or two on duty. When the bars close at 1 am and the drunks start going in the ditch and there's a fight too, you expect them to drop everything to arrest, process, and transport over 100 miles someone whose only crime is crossing the border without reporting to Customs?

[HeavyGunner]

2 hours ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Obviously you weren't paying attention during Civics class... Cities do not issue driver's licenses and ID cards to the public. neither do cities usurp the work of federal agencies like ICE.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxnews.com/us/2016/11/15/new-york-city-may-erase-id-card-data-to-protect-illegal-immigrants.amp.html?client=safari

You're also avoiding answering my question by dummying my point down. 1) sanctuary cities aren't little turd towns in middle America.  Chicago, San Diego and New York are the big mouths saying they will not help, so your silly comparison to a one sheriff town has no real bearing on this because that is not and has not been what the conversation has been about. So again, if an officer pulls someone over and they can't produce a state ID. Citizen or not, you'll likely be detained for driving without a license. So if in that process you're found to be here illegally, why couldn't or why wouldn't LEO's turn them over to the Feds???  I bet they would if it was someone on the FBIs most wanted list even though it's the feds that want the criminal. There is no reason these sanctuary cities can't do their part and help. If you read the article I posted, you'll see that NYC gave IDs to illegals and admits to it in the article. So they knowingly are helping illegals take advantage of this country. If you're here illegally, you shouldn't reap the benefits of this country. Obviously common sense wasn't taught in "civics" class. 

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Because even NYC has serious crime and can't waste their time and tax dollars on status offenses like immigration violations. I can't speak as much to NYC's situation, but I'm familiar with Minneapolis'- City of 400,000 in a  county of 1,000,000+ with a 800 officer PD and the county jail has only 800 capacity. That means the jail routinely fills up and there's simply no space to hold undocumented immigrants 'til ICE gets around to picking them up. Never mind the fact that at night the police are very short staffed and tied down dealing with felonies.

So you want to raise taxes to hire more police and bigger jails to hold these 11 million undocumented immigrants?

[kscarbel2]

58 minutes ago, HeavyGunner said:

https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxnews.com/us/2016/11/15/new-york-city-may-erase-id-card-data-to-protect-illegal-immigrants.amp.html?client=safari

You're also avoiding answering my question by dummying my point down. 1) sanctuary cities aren't little turd towns in middle America.  Chicago, San Diego and New York are the big mouths saying they will not help, so your silly comparison to a one sheriff town has no real bearing on this because that is not and has not been what the conversation has been about. So again, if an officer pulls someone over and they can't produce a state ID. Citizen or not, you'll likely be detained for driving without a license. So if in that process you're found to be here illegally, why couldn't or why wouldn't LEO's turn them over to the Feds???  I bet they would if it was someone on the FBIs most wanted list even though it's the feds that want the criminal. There is no reason these sanctuary cities can't do their part and help. If you read the article I posted, you'll see that NYC gave IDs to illegals and admits to it in the article. So they knowingly are helping illegals take advantage of this country. If you're here illegally, you shouldn't reap the benefits of this country. Obviously common sense wasn't taught in "civics" class. 

Aiding and abetting criminals, i.e. illegal immigrants.

I don't use the politically current term of late, "undocumented immigrant", which was deliberately conjured up to rebadge a criminal element, transforming them into into a softer and gentler non-issue.

"Undocumented" makes it sound as though its okay for them to be here, however they haven't completed all their paperwork. That connotation couldn't be farther from the truth.

Anyone who intentionally enters a country illegally is inherently a criminal and must be immediately deported.

Otherwise, and particularly in the case of the U.S., we'll have all of Latin America, Africa, the Middle East, Eastern Europe and much of Asia at our doorsteps tomorrow.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

You really want to pay to arrest, feed and house, and transport 11,000,000 people?

[kscarbel2]

26 minutes ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

You really want to pay to arrest, feed and house, and transport 11,000,000 people?

No, I have no intention of paying for it. Of course, the government should seize their assets.

Any money earned as an illegal immigrant working in the United States shall be seized, and become the property of the U.S. government.

It sends a strong and firm message that will deter other foreigners from entering the United States......illegally.

Our "legal" immigration channels are wide open, and reasonable. Our door remains open. However, we must have a zero tolerance policy regarding "illegal" immigrants.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Total U.S. jail capacity is a couple million, we have probably 11 million undocumented immigrants... Where we gonna put 'em?

[kscarbel2]

33 minutes ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Total U.S. jail capacity is a couple million, we have probably 11 million undocumented immigrants... Where we gonna put 'em?

On the other side of the fence.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

Doesn't work like that... The constitution guarantees them due process, so it usually takes months to decide if the get to stay or get a bus ride to the border.

[kscarbel2]

10 minutes ago, TeamsterGrrrl said:

Doesn't work like that... The constitution guarantees them due process, so it usually takes months to decide if the get to stay or get a bus ride to the border.

The United States Constitution applies to citizens and legal residents of the United States.

"We the people of the United States,"

It does NOT apply to illegal immigrants, criminal foreigners illegally on our soil.

[Truck Shop]

Fruits and vegetables are going to get real expensive, resulting in constipation.

[TeamsterGrrrl]

39 minutes ago, kscarbel2 said:

The United States Constitution applies to citizens and legal residents of the United States.

"We the people of the United States,"

It does NOT apply to illegal immigrants, criminal foreigners illegally on our soil.

True, after you give them due process to prove they're not legal residents...

[gearhead204]

On 11/18/2016 at 10:19 AM, Truck Shop said:

Fruits and vegetables are going to get real expensive, resulting in constipation.

YES!........I can't understand why we can't issue AG. worker visas to these people with some harsh penalty's if they are caught doing other types of work. Give them an ID #  and let them be taxed at a fair rate to cover whatever government services they may receive while in the states. The majority of these workers only want to work for the growing season and then return to Mexico, and "vacation" for several months before returning for the next years crop.

[other dog]

On 11/17/2016 at 8:51 PM, kscarbel2 said:

On the other side of the fence.

[kscarbel2]

Upon arrest and deportation, the assets of illegal immigrants (illegal economic migrants) should be summarily confiscated by the United States government.

Money earned by illegal immigrants is, inherently, illegally earned income.

Only by sending a clear and strong message can we stem the tide of “illegal” immigration.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Denmark confiscates, cash, valuables from “refugees” [economic migrants]

The Guardian  /  June 30, 2016

Denmark has seized valuables from asylum seekers for the first time, five months after passing a law that allows police to take cash and jewellery worth over 10,000 kroner (US$1,419) from them.

Police took 79,600 kroner (US$11,296) from five Iranians who flew into Copenhagen airport on Tuesday and immediately claimed asylum, the Danish immigration police said in a statement.

Since the five had travelled on false passports, they were arrested for forgery and searched – at which point their money was found and most of it confiscated.

Asylum seekers in Denmark can keep cash and valuables worth less than 10,000 kroner US$1,419) – anything more can be taken to pay for their care, according to the controversial legislation enacted in early February.

The Danish police are rigorously enforcing the law.

In a statement, Per Fiig, the head of Denmark’s immigration police centre, said: “Danish police every day look out for asylum seekers and foreigners staying illegally who could have valuables that could help finance the cost of their stay.”

Asylum applications have dropped dramatically in Denmark in 2016, compared to 2015. The government said 5,500 applications were received until 30 October, compared to 21,000 in 2015.

[Underdog]

Seems like many Hollywood elites unhappy with American politics, would find welcoming accommodation in Denmark.

[Joseph Moody Jr]

This issue with illegal immigrants will never end. Right now the courts are backlog of over 500, 000 which have court hearing schedule into 2019, Let say there is 2 million here and courts can do 250, 000 a year it will take another 8 years. So that will 10 years just this group to have court hearings. Then build a wall and those illegal immigrants that was sent back will try to enter this country thru tunnel, over or around ( Gulf of Mexico and Pacific Ocean ). A wall will never stop anyone just look at West and East Berlin, DMZ in Korea and Gaza Tunnels

[41chevy]

46 minutes ago, Joseph Moody Jr said:

This issue with illegal immigrants will never end. Right now the courts are backlog of over 500, 000 which have court hearing schedule into 2019, Let say there is 2 million here and courts can do 250, 000 a year it will take another 8 years. So that will 10 years just this group to have court hearings. Then build a wall and those illegal immigrants that was sent back will try to enter this country thru tunnel, over or around ( Gulf of Mexico and Pacific Ocean ). A wall will never stop anyone just look at West and East Berlin, DMZ in Korea and Gaza Tunnels

So we just open the borders to all ??