Florida High School Shooting - 17 confirmed dead

[grayhair]

Sound like a parenting problem.  Parents that allowed a dangerous, ignorant malcontent to fester under their supervision.  There's really no easy fix for bad genes and bad parenting.

Kid must have a really low, low IQ. And add a stunning lack of understanding of "actions and consequences."  Doesn't understand he will never drive a car again, never stroll down Main St. again, never go to a movie theater again, etc.  Just be somebodies bit-h for the rest of his days.  Obviously he didn't have any concept of consequences.  Hard to ignore the parents role in this awful situation.

[kscarbel2]

Donald J. Trump

 

✔ @realDonaldTrump

 

So many signs that the Florida shooter was mentally disturbed, even expelled from school for bad and erratic behavior. Neighbors and classmates knew he was a big problem.

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Last year, the government instructed the media to stop using the terms "illegal alien" and "illegal immigrant", and instead use the low-key, misleading and altogether wrong term "undocumented immigrant".

Now, President Trump is calling killers "mentally disturbed" individuals, rather than murderous criminals.

Any murderer, from Florida to Detroit to Chicago, is mentally disturbed.

Nobody with normal mental faculties would kill another human being.

Every criminal is mentally disturbed........normal folks aren't criminals.

Are we now going to put our hands around them and say: "He's sad, mournful and remorseful. He's just a broken human being. And have public defenders all make emotional public pleas for understanding?

 

[41chevy]

1 hour ago, kscarbel2 said:

Are we now going to put our hands around them and say: "He's sad, mournful and remorseful. He's just a broken human being. And have public defenders all make emotional public pleas for understanding?

 

Who after the shootings, stopped at Subway for a soda, Walmart for chips and Mac Donalds for a burger. Must be remorseful about not getting fries.

Schoolmate, Brody Speno, also recalled peculiar behavior."Something wasn't right about him," Speno recalled. "He was off." Speno said he knew Cruz from elementary school until his family moved away a couple of years ago. He described him as "an evil kid" who was "always getting in trouble."

He recalled Cruz stealing peoples' mail, throwing rocks at cars and tormenting animals. He described one incident in which he said Cruz "cornered a squirrel and was trying to throw rocks at it and kill it." He said police were called to the house "almost every other week."

Documents obtained by the Times  show that law enforcement officers responded to Cruz's house on 39 occasions over a seven-year period.

He had two Instagram accounts featuring weapons and photos. In one picture he is wearing a kerchief over his face and a Make America Great Again hat. Another photo is taken from behind a gun sight looking out the window.

There are online posts in which he writes:

"I wanna shoot people with my AR-15" and "Im going to be a professional school shooter"

The latter post, made with Cruz's name attached to it, was reported to the FBI. But FBI officials said they were unable to determine who was responsible.

This summer a Nikolas Cruz made an online comment in response to a story about a disgruntled doctor in New York who used an AR-15 to shoot seven people, killing one and wounding six others.

"Man, I can do so much better," he wrote.

The comment was linked to one of Cruz's YouTube accounts, which have since been removed in the wake of Wednesday's shooting.

Not everyone who crossed paths with Cruz saw reason for concern. Jim Lewis the attorney for the family who took him in after his mother's death said they were aware of trouble he'd earlier had at school and saw signs of depression. But, "we didn'tfeel there was any danger in his actions," Jim Lewis said.

Edited February 17, 2018 by 41chevy

[davehummell]

When i was a kid i knew what an apple tree switch felt like and i was first in line at a paddling by a 3 ft. yardstick. I really got what i deserved and i didn't end up hating my mother and grandmother. Today i look back and they were just doing their best to get me on the right track in life, I do think those video games that is all over the place are a little over the top but in my youth i loved roadrunner and bugsbunny's elmer fud so maybe i'm full of crap?

[Lmackattack]

I was out this afternoon and when I returned late tonight My wife asked me if I had heard about the FBI not looking into this threat 5 weeks ago.  I turned on the news and was so pissed when I heard this was over looked.  WTF is that.  Thats like calling 911 and the cops or fire dept never show up.   This person saw the threat, called into the FBI because they knew it was a serious issue above the local police dept level.  and nothing was done .  A quick look by any piss ant at the FBI would have found the social media posts and a interview with the caller could have provided many other tips to have headed this killing spree off.  My Father in law was a Orlando cop and he informed me of the Baker act.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_Mental_Health_Act

 

My local physician could have had him detained with a simple note....The FBI and local PD had clear evidence to stop and detain cruz if they would have checked their E-Mail or Voicemail..

 

 

So pissed right now...

[Bobby j]

Now I see on the news if the prosecutor will take the death penalty off the table  the shooter will immediately plead guilty what the hell.....how much damn time did the shooter give the seventeen he killed......I say hold his trial immediately and publicly hang him in front of the courthouse .....of course the liberals and the media are hollering for gun control ....but we never hear any thing about the thousands of children killed by abortion go figure.....and I sure don’t want to bring up the t.v. Show on abc called the view just this week the host Joie bahr called Vice President pence and Christians who talk to God mentally ill.....just my two cents 

 

 

 

 

 

[41chevy]

 

 

Every bodies fault but the killers. pathetic

 

 

 

 

Suspected Florida shooter seeks to avoid death penalty by pleading guilty

By John Bowden - 02/16/18 07:22 PM EST 348

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© Getty Images

A public defender representing the 19-year-old suspect in Wednesday's shooting at a Parkland, Florida, high school told reporters on Friday that his client would be willing to plead guilty in order to avoid the death penalty.

Broward County public defender Howard Finkelstein told ABC News that Nikolas Cruz, the former student charged in the shooting rampage that killed 17 people and wounded others, would plead guilty immediately in exchange for prosecutors to take the death penalty off the table.

 

"We have an opportunity to begin to put this behind us, to help the victims’ families as much as we can and begin to heal as a community,” Finkelstein said Friday evening.

“It comes down to one simple question: Does he live or does he die?” he added.

Finkelstein went on to add that his client is considering an insanity plea if a deal were not reached with prosecutors, adding that blame for the shooting also lay with law enforcement and local government.

"This is not a case for lawyer games. Everybody knows what happened. There’s no question about whether he committed this act. And there’s no question of whether this is the most horrific act ever in Broward County -- it is," the lawyer said.

"The school system failed. The mental health system failed. DCF [the Department of Children and Families], our social service agencies failed. Law enforcement failed because every red flag was present. And the FBI apparently failed. And the security measures for somebody to buy guns failed. Every single system was ignorant or willfully blind," Finkelstein said.

Cruz was charged with 17 counts of premeditated murder Thursday morning. A judge has ordered him held without bond.

President Trump, who is in Florida and is expected to visit with victims, pointed to mental illness as a reason for the shooting.

“So many signs that the Florida shooter was mentally disturbed, even expelled from school for bad and erratic behavior. Neighbors and classmates knew he was a big problem. Must always report such instances to authorities, again and again!” Trump tweeted Thursday.

[david wild]

I think they should turn him loose in the same school with a bunch of the parents, if he lives he lives, if not they take his corspe to the dump, they should let the parents decide his fate.  

[kscarbel2]

"The school system failed. The mental health system failed. DCF [the Department of Children and Families], our social service agencies failed. Law enforcement failed because every red flag was present. And the FBI apparently failed. And the security measures for somebody to buy guns failed. Every single system was ignorant or willfully blind," Finkelstein said.

Point the finger everywhere..........except where it belongs.

Cruz failed himself, his passed away parents, his community and his country.

Cruz is responsible for his actions.

 

[Lmackattack]

I 100% agree that Cruz is ultimately at fault. he was behind the trigger and acted alone. However the one solid defense we have to prevent this exact action was ignored by the people that we pay to help prevent this. And now all we will hear is we will review protocol (other wise known as make it even more complicated and fuck ups continue)   bottom line is if I dial 911 with a claim that I see someone about to cause harm the police show up. If I called the FBI about a terrorist threat to a school. I would hope they would send out someone to investigate the issue and question me on what I know about said threat.  This was complete lazy failure on the FBI. unless other facts come out to show the FBI did in fact do something I stand by my statements.

 

Trent

[HeavyGunner]

The fbi should be very embarrassed. The news said the cops were called 39 times for domestic disturbance when the kids parents were alive. He was being treated for mental illness and quit it with out anyone following up. All the signs were here and the fbi completely screwed this up. Be nice if we heard the media harp on that instead of gun control. 

[41chevy]

1 hour ago, HeavyGunner said:

The fbi should be very embarrassed. The news said the cops were called 39 times for domestic disturbance when the kids parents were alive. He was being treated for mental illness and quit it with out anyone following up. All the signs were here and the fbi completely screwed this up. Be nice if we heard the media harp on that instead of gun control. 

Guns and vehicles are the easiest things to target for political points, has zero to do with anything but votes and TV ratings.

Thought we got rid of life time support of crap when Manson died, now we replace him with this.  At least 50 to 60 years of supporting him with free education, media, health care and god knows what else. I for one am sick and tired of giving criminals a better life than many of our seniors and veterans get.

We'll have to see what comes from Obama's Town Hall meeting and his meeting with the victims parents tomorrow in Florida.  Guess he is still the one people turn to for help.  

[BillyT]

When I was in h.s. we got out at 3:15 during hunting season there was about an hour and a half of daylight and we had our shotguns and rifles in the car and nobody even thought about doing anything but going hunting! We learned gun safety as little kids! A ten year old in Pasco county Florida was the son of a deputy and his dad helped him with his homework one night, and the kid took dad's pen to school without giving it a thought! It had a Glock advertisement on it! They suspended the kid for several days!

[BillyT]

L Mack Cruz was a crystal clear candidate for the Baker act! All you have to be is a danger to yourself or society!

[hatcity]

11 minutes ago, BillyT said:

L Mack Cruz was a crystal clear candidate for the Baker act! All you have to be is a danger to yourself or society!

BUT!!!!!  you can check yourself out too

[Lmackattack]

if found to be sane.....

[kscarbel2]

 

[BillyT]

My opinion,and remember the old trucker saying.... "opinions are like a..holes, everybody has one!" Is that serial killers once found guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt, should be executed! And Cruz took the death penalty away by pleading guilty! Serial killers shouldn't have that option! Saw an article in the Tampa paper today,Cruz'attorneys admitted he was guilty! Said "we just want to see the "child" gets help"!! Two things come to mind, 1. The p.o.s is legally an adult! And 2. His attorneys (as in more than one) aren't concerned that he gets "help" they know that defending this monster can "make" their career! I seriously doubt this person could afford 15 minutes of the most inexperienced public defenders hourly rate! If youre concerned about "pro bono" publicity help the parents of the actual children, most under 16 years old sue all the agencies that failed to protect their children or the underpaid teachers that died trying to protect them! Every aspect of this situation makes my head explode!

[BillyT]

Concerning the death penalty,I respect those who object to it for religious reasons! But you have to provide a deterrent to all these psychos who would murder innocent people! My favorite deterrent would be the good old fashioned chain gang! The people who perpetrate these unspeakable acts can look forward to "three hots and a cot" or incarceration in a mental facility,all on the taxpayers dime! Give the taxpayer something for their money! Everywhere you look in America there is trash on the side of the road! We are a nation of slobs! Let the murderers pick it up! Slobs however annoying,aren't felons! Saw an interesting forensic files the other night! The Aussies have a couple of 19th century prisons without electricity or running water! But they still use them! Good place for the Cruzs of the world! Of course they need water and food to have enough energy to work on the chain gang,so have them dig their own well and pump the water by hand! Feed them the old c-rats before they expire, and grow their own food in season. Repurpose some old closed factories as prisons! They need recreation, after all, so let them take turns running a hand operated generator to keep the lights on while their fellow killers read books, those who read of course! Then publicize the snot out of the whole deal so those who would potentially murder their classmates will think twice! Will never happen of course it would be inhumane!...... like killing children!

[HeavyGunner]

The death penalty should be the deterrent in my opinion, as for hard labor prisons you're right title never work with all the softies in the world today. Sheriff Joe has something similar to what you spoke of and he catches hell all the time for being to mean. He had feeding the scum bags down to $0.30 or $0.40 a meal, was starting to make the prisoners farm their own food, they stay in Vietnam era military surplus walltents and cots. One of my favorite lines from one of the interview with sheriff joe was a criminal was complaining about it being to hot and inhumane to keep them in the desert without ac, without missing a beat joe said our soldiers volunteered to go and fight in the middle in 120+ degrees with full gear on, if you don't like it here don't come back. 

[tjc transport]

 sheriff Joe is no longer sheriff, and his tent city jail was eliminated because the snowflakes determined the criminals needed ac, hot and cold running water, cable tv, and all the other amenities non criminals have to work for.

[HeavyGunner]

19 minutes ago, tjc transport said:

 sheriff Joe is no longer sheriff, and his tent city jail was eliminated because the snowflakes determined the criminals needed ac, hot and cold running water, cable tv, and all the other amenities non criminals have to work for.

Doesn't surprise me. 

[RowdyRebel]

On 2/17/2018 at 9:32 AM, Lmackattack said:

if I dial 911 with a claim that I see someone about to cause harm the police show up

Not necessarily.  Courts have repeatedly ruled that the police do NOT have any "duty to respond" to any individual call, and therefore cannot be held liable for injuries sustained as a result of a delayed or totally absent response to a 911 call.

 

...and yet there are idiots who rely 100% upon those police to protect them.  When seconds matter, the police are only minutes away.

 

I read an ignorant post on Twitter yesterday about how the AR15 is the only weapon that can easily kill 17 people in 7 minutes.  I had to chime in, because my 1866 Yellowboy ("new" replica of an 1866 Winchester rifle) in the hands of an evil person would be more than capable of that feat using 150+ year old technology, especially in the absence of any "good guys with guns" to stop the attack.  Hell, a skilled individual can knock off a round every 15 seconds or so with a Revolutionary War era musket!  That equates to 28 shots in those 7 minutes...more than enough to accomplish what can "only" be done with an AR15.

Absolutely ridiculous what some uninformed people think they know.

[j hancock]

If a school bus driver was texting and killed students riding in the bus would there be screaming to ban phones? 

Only ban phones that can text?

Would people "feel" better that a bunch of students get killed because a sick person used a knife?  Do we ban knives?

If a bombing occurs with a pressure cooker type device, do we ban pressure cookers?

The weak link is the human.  A sick person has a LONG list of tools at their disposal. 

[Mack Technician]

On 2/18/2018 at 11:52 AM, BillyT said:

Concerning the death penalty,I respect those who object to it for religious reasons! But you have to provide a deterrent to all these psychos who would murder innocent people! My favorite deterrent would be the good old fashioned chain gang! The people who perpetrate these unspeakable acts can look forward to "three hots and a cot" or incarceration in a mental facility,all on the taxpayers dime! Give the taxpayer something for their money! Everywhere you look in America there is trash on the side of the road! We are a nation of slobs! Let the murderers pick it up! Slobs however annoying,aren't felons! Saw an interesting forensic files the other night! The Aussies have a couple of 19th century prisons without electricity or running water! But they still use them! Good place for the Cruzs of the world! Of course they need water and food to have enough energy to work on the chain gang,so have them dig their own well and pump the water by hand! Feed them the old c-rats before they expire, and grow their own food in season. Repurpose some old closed factories as prisons! They need recreation, after all, so let them take turns running a hand operated generator to keep the lights on while their fellow killers read books, those who read of course! Then publicize the snot out of the whole deal so those who would potentially murder their classmates will think twice! Will never happen of course it would be inhumane!...... like killing children!

I’m not as gracious, I argue the point. Bible supports Capital Punishment. Old and New Testament. You can read it upside down and backwards, but it comes out the same, Civil Government does not bear the sword in vain. My old pastor use to add “and swords are not for giving spankings”.