New Mack question?

[RobM626]

3 hours ago, 1965 said:

What about 1 of those Fitzgerald gliders 

I have had my eye on them for a few years now. I would absolutely love to get one but would be kinda pointless if I can’t run it in the city because it doesn’t have a dpf. 90% of our work is nyc

[Maxidyne]

Just want to throw this out for discussion- Would going to a smaller engine that is thus working harder reduce the number of parked regens?

[Mack Technician]

13 hours ago, Bullheaded said:

I talked to an engineer from Detroit at a big trucking industry trade show a couple years back. We talked about my issues with regens. His words of advice:

"Even though these new motors have lots of low end torque and we advertise running low RPM to save fuel........in you application forget about fuel economy and drive it like you stole it like an old two stroke."

Rob’s ‘05 was built in the same spirit. The IEGR in any OEM engine killed low end torque, we have multiple. Our off road will barely start in winter cause they won’t “torque up” against cold hyd oil to reach higher RPM. 

Mack quotes in the AI manual “Design to run high RPM in a vocational application”. AKA- Drive it like you stole it, keep the fuel delivery man on speed dial, or kill the emissions system. 

[RobM626]

17 minutes ago, Maxidyne said:

Just want to throw this out for discussion- Would going to a smaller engine that is thus working harder reduce the number of parked regens?

I had a sterling with a small Mercedes motor in it. I can’t recall exactly how many liters but definately less than 11. It might have been 9 or 10. And that motor would not get hot for the life of it in the winter. I had a heat exchanger installed on it that I plunged to the heater core that would heat the water tank for the concrete mixer and even at the end of the day that tank wasn’t as hot as the one on our mp8. So I dont know if that theory holds water?

[Bullheaded]

I am not a fan of this new emission crap, but they do seem to be improving little by little. But as much as the engine is an enemy in itself, the other bigger problem I experience is dealer techs that just don't know how to diagnose or fix them.

So many times I have had some emission system problem fixed, only to have another failure then find out it was because both components should have been changed at the same time.

And then stuff like I had the Detroit tech change a parameter in my ECM so that I can force a parked regen before the light comes on. That way I can do one after work every night instead of getting caught 3 hours into a shift. But then I go to dealer for a repair and all of a sudden that feature is gone?

Now since the last repair I don't get a parked regen warning light. It automatically goes to malfunction and check engine lights. It's like every dealer tech that works on it does something different to it.

 

On the next new one I was going to try going down to the DD13 now that it can be had with 1850 torque. The Detroit guy told me that should be better for my vocational application.

[RobM626]

7 minutes ago, Bullheaded said:

I am not a fan of this new emission crap, but they do seem to be improving little by little. But as much as the engine is an enemy in itself, the other bigger problem I experience is dealer techs that just don't know how to diagnose or fix them.

So many times I have had some emission system problem fixed, only to have another failure then find out it was because both components should have been changed at the same time.

And then stuff like I had the Detroit tech change a parameter in my ECM so that I can force a parked regen before the light comes on. That way I can do one after work every night instead of getting caught 3 hours into a shift. But then I go to dealer for a repair and all of a sudden that feature is gone?

Now since the last repair I don't get a parked regen warning light. It automatically goes to malfunction and check engine lights. It's like every dealer tech that works on it does something different to it.

 

On the next new one I was going to try going down to the DD13 now that it can be had with 1850 torque. The Detroit guy told me that should be better for my vocational application.

Were the test subjects for their r&d. And when there is a problem no one properly diagnoses the issue. They just throw parts at it on our expense and the root of the problem goes untouched

[Bullheaded]

You got that right Rob. We are just test pilots at our expense. Used to be a time you could pay your truck off and have a few years of profit. Now as soon as it's payed for you have to run out and replace it and back into payment.

 

But hey, we get to live the dream of being truckers! LOL.

[RobM626]

1 minute ago, Bullheaded said:

You got that right Rob. We are just test pilots at our expense. Used to be a time you could pay your truck off and have a few years of profit. Now as soon as it's payed for you have to run out and replace it and back into payment.

 

But hey, we get to live the dream of being truckers! LOL.

 

[terry]

34 minutes ago, RobM626 said:

 

😂😂😂

[kscarbel2]

4 hours ago, 1965 said:

What about 1 of those Fitzgerald gliders 

Is Fitzgerald doing any vocational models? With the superior Series 60, that would be one good way to go.

[RobM626]

21 minutes ago, kscarbel2 said:

Is Fitzgerald doing any vocational models? With the superior Series 60, that would be one good way to go.

You can get a Peterbilt 388 with a dump body on it or just the chassis and have it sent to whatever upfitter you want

[kscarbel2]

1 hour ago, RobM626 said:

You can get a Peterbilt 388 with a dump body on it or just the chassis and have it sent to whatever upfitter you want

Fitzgerald's website doesn't show a Peterbilt 300 series vocational model offering (e.g. 367)...................https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/peterbilt/

However they do offer the Kenworth T800...........https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/kenworth/kenworth-t800/

As well as the Western Star 4900SB.................https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/western-star/western-star-4900-sb/

I would buy as many Fitzgerald Series 60-powered T800s as you can afford, before the government brings their business to a halt. This is a truck....an engine.... that you can make a living with.

[RobM626]

47 minutes ago, kscarbel2 said:

Fitzgerald's website doesn't show a Peterbilt 300 series vocational model offering (e.g. 367)...................https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/peterbilt/

However they do offer the Kenworth T800...........https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/kenworth/kenworth-t800/

As well as the Western Star 4900SB.................https://www.fitzgeraldgliderkits.com/western-star/western-star-4900-sb/

I would buy as many Fitzgerald Series 60-powered T800s as you can afford, before the government brings their business to a halt. This is a truck....an engine.... that you can make a living with.

I’ve spoken to a salesman there numerous times they can do the Pete’s as well... there’s a bit of a wait on them but it’s doable. A guy I know in Iowa got a mixer mounted on one and he loves it. Says it’s a beast. 

I Wish I lived somewhere else so I can get them and not have to worry about emissions laws going into effect

[Mack Technician]

On 11/28/2018 at 8:03 AM, RobM626 said:

That would be nice!

For what it's worth I can give you a couple break downs on our Kenworth cost centers

Both T440

One Roll-off, one tandem dump

Both Cummins ISL @ 345 horse

Both Allison 3000RDS

2011 Tandem Dump $7.78 per hour total maintenance

2010 Roll-off $11.74 per hour total maintenance

includes all outside/inside repairs and all parts including tires, internal and external labor, etc. Roll off has a hard life, clearly....one job is to deliver caustic ash.  Don't have enough fleet diversity to make a case...

[kscarbel2]

2 hours ago, RobM626 said:

I’ve spoken to a salesman there numerous times they can do the Pete’s as well... there’s a bit of a wait on them but it’s doable. A guy I know in Iowa got a mixer mounted on one and he loves it. Says it’s a beast. 

I Wish I lived somewhere else so I can get them and not have to worry about emissions laws going into effect

You said Peterbilt 388.....that's a highway truck chassis. You'd need a 367.

[RobM626]

14 hours ago, kscarbel2 said:

You said Peterbilt 388.....that's a highway truck chassis. You'd need a 367.

Hmm... everyone around here rounds them with double frames... After looking further into it I think they only do the gliders in a couple models. 388-389 and 5 something

[RobM626]

16 hours ago, Mack Technician said:

For what it's worth I can give you a couple break downs on our Kenworth cost centers

Both T440

One Roll-off, one tandem dump

Both Cummins ISL @ 345 horse

Both Allison 3000RDS

2011 Tandem Dump $7.78 per hour total maintenance

2010 Roll-off $11.74 per hour total maintenance

includes all outside/inside repairs and all parts including tires, internal and external labor, etc. Roll off has a hard life, clearly....one job is to deliver caustic ash.  Don't have enough fleet diversity to make a case...

Those numbers don’t seem too bad to me...I gotta look over my numbers and compare, but looks about same maybe a little lower. How many days/hours a week do those trucks work?

[Mack Technician]

The dump truck is running about 30 hours a week hauling snow, garbage or biomass. The roll off is dedicated to 24/7 intermittent use so hard to average.

 

[RobM626]

14 hours ago, Mack Technician said:

The dump truck is running about 30 hours a week hauling snow, garbage or biomass. The roll off is dedicated to 24/7 intermittent use so hard to average.

 

Yea I try to average my numbers using 8hours a day, 5 days a week. But we’re running  like 12 hours a day, 6 days a week

[MACKS]

On 11/28/2018 at 8:02 AM, RobM626 said:

Yea I hear ya with the speed. I like to have the torque when I’m grossing 80-85000lbs though. Most of the time the 15 liter is not needed. And it’s probably the most expensive option on the truck. 

So how do you think the mp8 compares to the x12? What would you go with?

How are u grossing 85,000 lbs in NY and what size body's are u running,must be huge?

[RobM626]

4 minutes ago, MACKS said:

How are u grossing 85,000 lbs in NY and what size body's are u running,must be huge?

Definately not legally. Body is like 19 yards. Truck empty is 31,000 ...  I try not to put more than 20 tons but I usually have to carry 25-26 tons so that puts me at like 83,000. Whenever I can I try to not overload but with traffic here sometimes I don’t have time to make another load... if I’m hauling broken concrete which is what I’m doing most of the time I usually stay around 70-74000 because of the voids 

[Bullheaded]

What were you thinking of getting as far as specs Rob? I see you mentioned Allison auto.

Not sure if I told you but I talked to my friends that drive for the big contractor here that we all haul for. In about 2008 they had Allison auto's, then within the last two or 3 years they got new Western Star 4900's with the Eaton 18 speed auto's, then just got the new Mack Granite's with M-Drive.

Their opinions.....hate the Eaton's. Hard shifting, hunts gears more than the others. Love the M-Drive. Said the only thing that puts the Allison over the M-Drive for them is when working in the city they said the Allison is just so smooth. You don't feel it changing gears at all. Just like a car.

And of coarse like most big companies and the crappy sales people and dealers we have around here.....I asked if their M-Drives have any of the new features that make them nicer for paving with spreaders, like where you can shift into gear to leave the spreader without touching the brake to put it in gear. And of coarse they had no idea and tried it, and no.

The M-Drive has a lot of nice and useful features.....IF YOU ENABLE THEM, LOL.

 

Here's what they got. Nice looking units.

[RobM626]

Those are beautiful trucks... that triaxle is nice and long too... 

i was thinking at least 455 hp. 20k front, 46k rear, 20k pusher, spring suspension, WB at least 237”, 17.5-18’ steel high lift dump body, and I’m leaning towards the Allison tranny because we’ve had good luck with them. Change the oil and filter once a year and it’s pretty much problem free... I get mixed reviews on the Eaton ultra shift. Whoever I know that is running them don’t really like them and said they have issues With them. The m-drive I heard people like and I believe they’re built for the job especially with those creeper gears. The reason I don’t really wanna go with the automated manual is because it still has a clutch as opposed to a torque converter and in the wrong hands has potential to be abused if not driven The right way. I know how to drive them correctly but some guys don’t. If they drive it like a regular automatic they constantly slip the clutch and heat it up. I just don’t wanna open the door to unnecessary problems on a brand new truck. What do you think?

ih and geared low at least a 4.10 rear. I see some guys running even 4.80

[kscarbel2]

But the Mack brand M-drive, a rebadged Volvo I-shift, only has one countershaft. Can one work? Obviously it's possible with precautions taken, but my personal preference from experience is to divide the load stress between two. Eaton and market leader ZF, for example, all have two.

On Eaton, we've seen almost 4 jumps in tech since their original AMT.....be sure you try their current product before your judge.

[Bullheaded]

I see the 445 rating is a lot more popular than the 505. I have read in a few sources they say they pull just as good but have better fuel mileage?

Can't go wrong with an Allison. I can't comment on gearing for them though. I've driven them but never owned one for myself. I do know they are geared a lot lower than a manual.

What do you guys run in NY.....just one lift axle? I wish our government didn't force us to use these ridiculously long trucks. We have 21 foot boxes. So on hourly jobs under the shovel they just over load you that much more. 

I have 266 inch wheelbase, 20 and 46's also. Running 4.30 gears with 18 speed manual and 22.5 rubber. Not great for fuel mileage but probably better for DPF. Plus I am all hills here. And because of this SPIF law with the self equalizing steering lift axle it is working out better to use air-ride suspension, which I already was anyway. The load cells on mechanical suspensions hasn't proved to be as reliable as far as it working properly.

I miss the articulation of my old HMX rubber block and Camelback though. And I find I get more odd tire wear with the air ride. But the air ride is better in sand and doesn't washboard the haul roads up as much. But you have to play with the dump valve lots to get traction in uneven ground.