Licensed to kill Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 Yes, you read that right. I'm doing things backwards. The diff I'm getting has hub pilot budds of course but I want to stay with daytons. From what I understand the outside bearings are the same but the inner bearing is smaller on the daytons. I can deal with that but, as i was walking past my B-61 yesterday I noticed that it has 5 or 6 bolt axles. Well THAT certainly isnt going to work as the chance that the spline for the side gears is the same in both diffs is pretty much nill (plus the lengths may be different also). So, that leads me to finding some newer dayton hubs that take 8 bolt axles. My question is, to those that have done the typical swap from dayton to budd, are all 8 bolt axles the same bolt pattern? and, is there a visual difference between the hubs that came on the B and the newer 5 spoke daltons that take the 8 bolt axles? (or anything else i need to know). Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
doubleclutchinweasel Posted June 5, 2021 Share Posted June 5, 2021 You'd think that all those guys that pulled the Daytons off would have some parts lying around that might help you! Maybe they would swap you for your Budd setup? 1 Quote "Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines." Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Licensed to kill Posted June 5, 2021 Author Share Posted June 5, 2021 I had complete;y forgotten that I have daytons with the 8bolt axles on my parts truck (R model bucket truck). I suppose I could wait until the "new" diff gets here and measure the bolt pattern to see if they are compatible. My parts truck hubs are 5 spoke, the B-61 has 6 spoke but that should still look OK. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladislav Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 R-models had both 5 or 6 spoke rear hubs and it depended on the weight rating. The bearings were different but some (many?) axle spindels were the same. Usually 6 bolt jack shaft flanges were used with heavier 6 spoke hubs and had floating shaft and that domed flange (cap) you see at the outside. 8 bolt shafts were made together with the flange. Many Macks of the era (80's) had the same size although other truck brands (non-Mack axles) had them different and the splines either. Also worth to point out I have aluminium budd hubs on a R-model with stud piloted Alcoas and 5 spoke Daytons on MH. Both have similar 8-bolt jack shafts and used the same bearings - 563/567 outer with 572/582 inner. But the seals (surprizingly) are different. Can not say anything about B-series. And how it looks to me your way is taking both hubs off the axles and check out everything. 1 Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474789 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 I just converted an '86 Superliner from spoke to budd wheels for a friend of mine. He still has the spoke hubs, rims, spacers, and drums. If you think you need these parts let me know and I will try to get a price for the whole pallet.. P.M. me if you'd like.. jojo 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474794 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Licensed to kill Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 6 hours ago, Vladislav said: Usually 6 bolt jack shaft flanges were used with heavier 6 spoke hubs and had floating shaft and that domed flange (cap) you see at the outside. 8 bolt shafts were made together with the flange. Many Macks of the era (80's) had the same size although other truck brands (non-Mack axles) had them different and the splines either. My B has 6 spoke with 6 bolt axles (just like you describe) but I'm not sure I follow what you mean about "floating shaft". Is the shaft (axle) not a single forging with the flange? Are you saying the the axle SHAFT and the flange are two separate pieces on the 6 bolt?. Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474796 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Licensed to kill Posted June 6, 2021 Author Share Posted June 6, 2021 1 hour ago, Joey Mack said: I just converted an '86 Superliner from spoke to budd wheels for a friend of mine. He still has the spoke hubs, rims, spacers, and drums. If you think you need these parts let me know and I will try to get a price for the whole pallet.. P.M. me if you'd like.. jojo I appreciate the offer but suspect that the shipping would be prohibitive. 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474797 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Mack Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 Yes sir... shipping will be expensive. I just realized you are in Canada.... The axle he is describing is 2 piece, axle and splined hub cap... Jojo Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmackpaul Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 5 hours ago, Licensed to kill said: My B has 6 spoke with 6 bolt axles (just like you describe) but I'm not sure I follow what you mean about "floating shaft". Is the shaft (axle) not a single forging with the flange? Are you saying the the axle SHAFT and the flange are two separate pieces on the 6 bolt?. From 44,000 pound upwards Macks have a separate cap on the end and the axle is splined on both ends and floats between the the cone shaped cap on the hub and the spider gears in the diff 44's and up in Australia were this way with Mack's 44's have 6 bolts holding the cone to the hub 58's up to around 65 have 8 studs And even bigger Macks had 10 studs, dunno what rating they changed and I have never seen one of the real big ones except on photos on this forum Someone older and much wiser can probably answer that I'm a bit lost with what back end your gunna chuck under the B61, I haven't seen it mentioned yet Paul Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474810 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vladislav Posted June 6, 2021 Share Posted June 6, 2021 5 hours ago, Licensed to kill said: My B has 6 spoke with 6 bolt axles (just like you describe) but I'm not sure I follow what you mean about "floating shaft". Is the shaft (axle) not a single forging with the flange? Are you saying the the axle SHAFT and the flange are two separate pieces on the 6 bolt?. Ok, my gray matter feels a bit more relaxed now since it's evening and it was morning when I typed that post. Actually the things are more complex. There are (at least) two styles of Mack 6-bolt axle shafts. One of them has slightly domed, about flat flange. About the same look as the 8-bolt flange but for 6 bolts. These shafts are made together with the flange. As one piece, the same as 8-bolt shaft. Another style has a cone look. Also 6 bolts (and the same pattern?) but the center gets outside sufficiently. Those "mushrooms" are a separate castings with inner splines. The shafts used with them are just straight shafts. One end in the differential and another in the mushroom-flange. Interesting point I have this style on my 1945 Mack and there are additional seals which installed right in the "mushrooms'. Ok, caps or flanges, never mind. The reason is they seal against the axle spindel end so oil from diff doesn't go to wheel bearings. And the bearings roll in grease. Not sure newer axles have such desingn either but the outer look of the flanges is almost similar. I belive 6-bolt flanges were used on 44000 pound axles and 8-bolt ones on 38000 and 34000 axles. 1 Quote Никогда не бывает слишком много грузовиков! leversole 11.2012 Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474811 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mowerman Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 Just put their rear ends under it from the parts truck ha ha that’s what I would do … good luck bob Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474836 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddog13407 Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 actually gets more complex.... 38000 and up Macks had the cone or full floating axle shafts with 6 bolts. full floating meanin it floated in that dome cover... and alot of the times with abuse pushed the cover right out. 34000 rears hadthe 8 bolts or 'Rockwell style'' axles. sometime after you could get 38 or 44's with flat cap single floating axles. most b and early r models with cones were 38 or 44s 2 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474855 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsmackpaul Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 18 hours ago, Maddog13407 said: actually gets more complex.... 38000 and up Macks had the cone or full floating axle shafts with 6 bolts. full floating meanin it floated in that dome cover... and alot of the times with abuse pushed the cover right out. 34000 rears hadthe 8 bolts or 'Rockwell style'' axles. sometime after you could get 38 or 44's with flat cap single floating axles. most b and early r models with cones were 38 or 44s Im allconfuzzelled now lol Yes Mack made and sold a huge variety in the U.S. compared to Australia I guess the parts supply was in their mind the whole time Paul 1 Quote Link to comment https://www.bigmacktrucks.com/topic/66913-from-budds-to-daytons/#findComment-474912 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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