Eaton 13 speed

[TimberJack]

I’ve got a CHU with a 505 and 3.63 gears. The transmission is a T310 but started making a noise like a bearing going out. My question is how would a Eaton 13 speed do in it? Not really looking for high speed but better low rang for coming out of the woods. 

[fjh]

10 hours ago, TimberJack said:

I’ve got a CHU with a 505 and 3.63 gears. The transmission is a T310 but started making a noise like a bearing going out. My question is how would a Eaton 13 speed do in it? Not really looking for high speed but better low rang for coming out of the woods. 

Are you sure its the trans making noise? What does it sound like?

[67RModel]

An Eaton 13 speed would be "worse" ratio wise compared to the T310 for woods work. See The ratios for the first 5 gears listed below for each transmission.

T310

1st: 13.81

2nd: 10.05

3rd: 7.18

4th: 5.17

5th: 3.75

 

Eaton 13:

Low: 12.31

1st: 8.64

2nd: 6.11

3rd: 4.43

4th: 3.23

An Eaton 13 speed is more of a road transmission better suited for maintianing highway speeds in hilly terrain hence why you can split all the high range gears. You need a vocational transmission with several low hole gears. 

[TimberJack]

Fjh it’s a whin noise, pulled back box an the bottom counter shaft tapered bearing is gone. 

[TimberJack]

5 hours ago, 67RModel said:

An Eaton 13 speed would be "worse" ratio wise compared to the T310 for woods work. See The ratios for the first 5 gears listed below for each transmission.

T310

1st: 13.81

2nd: 10.05

3rd: 7.18

4th: 5.17

5th: 3.75

 

Eaton 13:

Low: 12.31

1st: 8.64

2nd: 6.11

3rd: 4.43

4th: 3.23

An Eaton 13 speed is more of a road transmission better suited for maintianing highway speeds in hilly terrain hence why you can split all the high range gears. You need a vocational transmission with several low hole gears. 

Ok thanks, this is the only Mack I have with the Mack transmission besides the Mdrive. The others have Eaton. I’ve got a 13 and a 18 was hoping to be able to use one. 

[Mark T]

Depending which 18 , some models are lower than the 13.   The 18 speed RTLOs have a lower low gear than the 13s (some depending on gear set)  The 13 can be converted to an 18.  Sounds like a pretty fast axle to try and accomplish crawling through soft earth loaded no matter what transmission.   

[TimberJack]

32 minutes ago, Mark T said:

Depending which 18 , some models are lower than the 13.   The 18 speed RTLOs have a lower low gear than the 13s (some depending on gear set)  The 13 can be converted to an 18.  Sounds like a pretty fast axle to try and accomplish crawling through soft earth loaded no matter what transmission.   

The 18 I have is a RTLO18918B. Yeah when the ground is really soft we normally push with dozer or skidder. 

[Mark T]

RTLO 18s have a low (low ratio)  I'd look it up but I wanna say like 14 to 1 (?)   If I'm not mistaken the T310 is very close to the ratios of an 8LL (if it's one with reverse on the yellow button.... then there's two of those just to make it interesting (lol)  I think it's the MLR has some really low gears (like 17 to 1)    I think that 18B is like 14 to 1, check it out .

[67RModel]

Mack made a slew of different T3XX series transmissions. A lot of them have creeper low hole and reverse gears. Generally speaking mack transmissions are generally geared slightly lower than their Eaton equivalent.

it’s been covered a bunch of times on here but switching to an Eaton transmission is a pretty involved process. It’s not just a simple as pulling one and replacing it with the other.

[Mark T]

13 minutes ago, 67RModel said:

Mack made a slew of different T3XX series transmissions. A lot of them have creeper low hole and reverse gears. Generally speaking mack transmissions are generally geared slightly lower than their Eaton equivalent.

it’s been covered a bunch of times on here but switching to an Eaton transmission is a pretty involved process. It’s not just a simple as pulling one and replacing it with the other.

How true.   It can get confusing .  Maybe he has the one that's just a basic ten speed ?   ( I myself can't tell from the picture)

[Joey Mack]

I'm a little curious??  Why are you not trying to repair the T-310?  Is there a lot more wear in the main box?  I can see the oil is junk, so its been running dirty oil..  Its not a hard tranny too re-bearing. and setting bearing pre-load is easy..  I see the aux. drive hub is showing wear on the teeth, so a new synchro is in order..  I do know that it is expensive. Our local tranny re-builder uses PAI parts.. 

anyway,  Eatons are great... I'm just Mack Proud..  jojo

[fjh]

12 hours ago, 67RModel said:

Mack made a slew of different T3XX series transmissions. A lot of them have creeper low hole and reverse gears. Generally speaking mack transmissions are generally geared slightly lower than their Eaton equivalent.

it’s been covered a bunch of times on here but switching to an Eaton transmission is a pretty involved process. It’s not just a simple as pulling one and replacing it with the other.

Bummer

Funny its usually  one of the upper bearings that fail!

How ever once if  you switch you never look back ! The fuller is a far more dependable trans ! Worth the work in my mind! sorry Joe!😅 Finding a trans is the hard part! As Joe mentioned the rebuild is easy enough if they don't gouge to hard on the parts PAI is quite reasonable for parts ! question is Do you re use the synchro plates all the bits you replace can ad up to allot! Easy to look at it from our perspective as you pointed out Joe ! Looking at it from a reliability perspective the fuller 18 is more reliable !

 

  

[Joey Mack]

I respect what you say FJH.. and yes.in the long run Eaton is better..  I guess I should look at this through, eyes other than mine..  I see a tranny that I can re-build with my current tools, and do it in my shop.. You give a good perspective..  Jojo

[TimberJack]

It’s just a standard T310 (105yx). I’m just thinking why rebuild it when I have to perfectly good transmissions laying in the shop, a 13 and 18 Eaton. All my out Mack’s have either the Mdrive or Eaton. I swapped one years ago in a 2004 ch. it had same transmission an I put a 8ll in its place. 

[masterwelder]

I have done this a few times.

Easy way is to get the vin of a similar truck that came from the factory with a 8ll, 13 or 18. Use that vin to verify and potentially source the correct transmission bell housing and or frame mounts for the Eaton going in. If I remember correctly the frame side mounts may be ok and the transmission bell housing mounts needs to be changed.

You will need a bell housing for Mack that has the spot to bolt the mounts to. 
 

Drive shaft length will probably need to be modified. 
 

You may need a different top cover for the Eaton to get the shifting lever in the correct spot. 
 

You may need to make or modify clutch linkage and or brackets. 
 

Spedo sensor location on the tail shaft has worked.  
 

I think that covers the big stuff, may be a few other small things- reverse switch, trans cooling lines…

Edited February 25, 2023 by masterwelder

[masterwelder]

I would go with the 18 to be able to split the bottom especially with you rear gears. 
 

 

[TimberJack]

The 18 I have came out of a Mack chu with 3.56 rears I believe, so it has the correct bell housing an top plate. I know the drive shaft with need to be redone an that’s no biggie. Only difference between the truck it came out of is mine has 3.63

[Mark T]

If it's a 505, the bell housing isn't the issue like it was with grey engines.  If you don't have a PTO, it's a relatively easy swap.   At this point, you almost have to wonder about availability of Mack transmission parts by the time the next repair rolls around.  (yes I realize that's a sad perspective on things)  Let's face it though, Volvo has no interest in manual Mack transmissions.  

[fjh]

14 hours ago, Mark T said:

If it's a 505, the bell housing isn't the issue like it was with grey engines.  If you don't have a PTO, it's a relatively easy swap.   At this point, you almost have to wonder about availability of Mack transmission parts by the time the next repair rolls around.  (yes I realize that's a sad perspective on things)  Let's face it though, Volvo has no interest in manual Mack transmissions.  

So True Mark ! They are lickin their chops to bury this dog thing they bought into! That said they kept it going a lot longer than I expected! It will be much easier once they ditch the cab ! That way they just have a hood modification every couple of years to keep up with the times!😡

[Mark T]

I agree. Honestly though, the transmission mount part ......I'm ok with that.   Eaton isn't too far behind with manual transmissions either.    8LL, FRO 10s, 13 and 18  final four.