237 bucking/ very sensitive throttle

[b61fred]

Update..

  I loaded up the family yesterday and made the trek to Delphi, IN to get a parts injection pump from Ron Bogan. I got home late and I was able to get the governor removed and disassembled. Today’s job is to see about getting the one off of the B61 and look for a smoking gun inside of there. Wish me luck! 

[mrsmackpaul]

Hmmm, this is quite the undertaking if you haven't done it before

Im interested to see how this goes

 

Paul

[b61fred]

Well I removed the governor and found the culprit! The internal shaft on the throttle was worn just enough to slop around. I made a video on YouTube to describe what was wrong and what I done to fix it if you want to see. 
thanks for all your help.

 

[Full Floater]

On 5/29/2023 at 7:05 PM, b61fred said:

Well I removed the governor and found the culprit! The internal shaft on the throttle was worn just enough to slop around. I made a video on YouTube to describe what was wrong and what I done to fix it if you want to see. 
thanks for all your help.

 

Awesome!  Thanks for sharing the video and your findings.  Can't wait to watch it.

[fjh]

1 hour ago, Full Floater said:

Awesome!  Thanks for sharing the video and your findings.  Can't wait to watch it.

Yup good job! 🙏 so just as a note if you look at the pump you can see there is a multi fingered spring attached to the governor drive gear you should check that for evidence of wear ! That is an over run clutch if that shows evidence of a lot wear it needs to be addressed as if it gets to weak the engine can  over speed and or run away if your not paying attention ! These were updated in later years to a flexible nylon rubberized affair coupler as they were more reliable! Also  obviously  a ANY wear in Any of those moving parts shafts and pins will contribute to surge in these pumps so you need to pay close attention to all wear parts ! Very well explained vid by the way! 

[b61fred]

fjh,

  I checked the over running/ lovejoy gear (had it called several things) and it checked ok. I figured that I had rambled on enough as it was in the video, I guess the secret is out on how to turn the pump up! haha... Those injection pumps are boxes of black magic, the guys that work on them have to sacrifice a goat or something to get them to work right! Just joking around, I know they are professionals.

p.s.  You did like and subscribe?  

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by b61fred

[mrsmackpaul]

Great video, I left a comment and gave you a like

Can you explain more about the droop screw??

All interesting to me 

 

Paul

[b61fred]

The droop screw is effectively changing the sensitivity of the governor. If you look at a graph of the torque curve as the engine is being loaded it will have a “droop” before the governor starts to compensate for the load, usually around 5 percent. This is very common adjustment on generator sets, they need a very short rpm droop as the load is applied due to the rpm of the engine has a lot to do with the cycles in electricity. In truck engines I think it pulls fuel if the engine is loaded momentarily so as not to burn it up.

[b61fred]

Here is a video of the test drive. I think it runs much smoother than I can shift, but I heard it down the road just the same.

 

Edited June 1, 2023 by b61fred

[doubleclutchinweasel]

Sounds great now.

[Mark T]

No goats 🦌 were harmed in the making of the videos (lol)   I think Fred may have played us all a little here (in a good way)  Seems like this wasn't the first time he's had a governor  apart.   Great stuff no matter.  Like I said before, fewer and fewer people are capable of making such repairs.   Thanks for sharing and explaining.

[doubleclutchinweasel]

22 minutes ago, Mark T said:

No goats 🦌 were harmed in the making of the videos (lol)   I think Fred may have played us all a little here (in a good way)  Seems like this wasn't the first time he's had a governor  apart.   Great stuff no matter.  Like I said before, fewer and fewer people are capable of making such repairs.   Thanks for sharing and explaining.

Not a problem. Even a good mechanic, if he’s smart, will sometimes ask for opinions before tearing into something. You never know when someone will have the exact knowledge you need. 
I’m glad he got it smoothed out. And, yes, I believe he may have been into one or two before!

[Mark T]

Yes.....  not his first .  We don't have a pump guy here anymore.  The go to guy in my area here passed away a little while back, and I don't think the Mack dealer in Allentown has the pump shop anymore. 

[davehummell]

Mark you referring to Charley at Dunmore Injection? I had a Mack pump adjusted out in Williamsport and a friend called out this spring and they are gone. Enzo used to do Cummins but I can't remember if he screwed around with Mack pumps He was at the Kingston Franconi shop quite a few years ago. Cooky's sold the Mack dealer up in Scranton and they don't sell Mack parts anymore !!! Back in the early 80's had a Mack pump rebuilt at a shop out in Hazleton.

[b61fred]

Well....

   The only other injection pump I have been into was on a Caterpillar D2 that I rebuilt everything on. Sitting down and reading a repair manual helps me, I have a tendency to "reverse engineer" components to understand how things are supposed to work. When I asked the question about what is usually the issue that causes this problem the response that I keyed in on was the throttle arm break over spring. Mine was in excellent shape but I knew that something was very sloppy somewhere in the governor or the linkage. These things are pretty simple inside and I don't make my living with it. It actually had a little wear everywhere, so if I had a reputation as an injection pump rebuilder, I would have replaced all the worn parts inside. I know that would be pricey and may not be possible because parts may not be available anymore. You could not imagine how quickly a dis-satisfied customer will tell everyone at the coffee shop you screwed up, even though you might have made it very plain the risk of used/worn parts and the outcome could be much less than perfect. This goes for all facets of the service industry, restaurants, dentists to mechanics. I always thought it might be nice to be an aircraft mechanic because if something needs to be replaced there is no question about cost, but then there is the liability thing.... 🤔 

[Mark T]

21 hours ago, davehummell said:

Mark you referring to Charley at Dunmore Injection? I had a Mack pump adjusted out in Williamsport and a friend called out this spring and they are gone. Enzo used to do Cummins but I can't remember if he screwed around with Mack pumps He was at the Kingston Franconi shop quite a few years ago. Cooky's sold the Mack dealer up in Scranton and they don't sell Mack parts anymore !!! Back in the early 80's had a Mack pump rebuilt at a shop out in Hazleton.

Charley's gone.  Dick Laing up in Binghamton got absorbed by D & W .  I don't think the old Allentown Mack does it anymore.  The others ??? IDK. 

[davehummell]

B61 Fred in 1973 I started to work on cat equipment we did countless pumps in the one vice on the bench those older cat pumps were alright to work on. These days I don't think I could remember how to do one, used to like reworking the 1693 pumps for the owner operators back in the day fuel was cheap so more smoke was good.