R-model Rain Gutter

[Lmackattack]

Roof is off. I death wheeled it off so that I can stand inside the cab and rotobroach thru the gutter welds. No rust in the front corners so thats good news. there was one spot on the passenger side above the vent window that has rust thru to the rain rail. looks like a fairly easy repair tho.

the rear part of the gutter rail is shot. Its started to seaparate from the upper cab wall as soon as the roof came off. In this location the 2nd layer of sheet metal behind the roof skin is also shot as it has 3 large holes in it. However I think I can repair all of this when the gutter is off as its looks like it stops where the roof, gutter, and cab wall all meet?

I also pulled the rear window and the only sign of rust was at the very bottom of the window around one of the holes that was drilled for the old sleeper boot.

so as it sits the cab interior is gutted, passenger seat removed, Im going to pull the stacks off tomorrow, remove both doors and reseal the door channel , pull the windshields to address any seams that need . Address all seals and weld joints before I paint the cab.

the only other issues I see right now is with the cab mount stacks....A few of the inner brackets that the stack clamps bolt to have rusted and the nuts are spinning. you cant see them as they are hidden behind the rear door jam. I need cut them the cab and reweld nuts to them.

guess what my weekend looks like....

[Lmackattack]

here is the damage....

[Rob]

here is the damage....

Your just getting started. I'm not surprised with what I see. You still have a couple of hard hours ahead drilling the spotwelds. Glad the windshield perimeter is in fine shape from the photos but there is still more to reveal. Don't get lazy and cut the roof skin trailers off without drilling the flange spotwelds. Seen that done more times than I can count and it always accelerates the return of the rust.

Keep going, you're making great progress.

Rob

[Lmackattack]

I did not take a good pic of the gutter where the spot welds are. So far I did the whole drivers side yesterday and did part of the front corners tonight. I drilled the welds out then did some grinding and used vice grips to pull the roof flange out of the gutter. then went back and grinded a little more in the hi spots. Once the welds are drilled out I will start smoothing out the gutter rail and address the metal with rust holes in them. I pulled the windshields tonight and the metal was solid but saw a few places that show it may be starting to spread the seam? wondering if I just drill a small hole above that aera to spray that rust fire or Por15 over the questionable aera?

How does the rear gutter stick to the cab? looks as if it has some tabs that weld to the rear skin? any secrets with it?

Trent

[Rob]

I did not take a good pic of the gutter where the spot welds are. So far I did the whole drivers side yesterday and did part of the front corners tonight. I drilled the welds out then did some grinding and used vice grips to pull the roof flange out of the gutter. then went back and grinded a little more in the hi spots. Once the welds are drilled out I will start smoothing out the gutter rail and address the metal with rust holes in them. I pulled the windshields tonight and the metal was solid but saw a few places that show it may be starting to spread the seam? wondering if I just drill a small hole above that aera to spray that rust fire or Por15 over the questionable aera?

How does the rear gutter stick to the cab? looks as if it has some tabs that weld to the rear skin? any secrets with it?

Trent

The rear cab panel is one piece from the bottom to the top where your's is rotted away. The gutter is bent at an angle and welds to the rear panel that will be up under the roof skin when all is said and done. It must be installed prior to the roof skin being mounted.

Rob

[other dog]

I tried to fix mine with some scrap 4x4's, used shingles, and some gutters from Lowes. I quickly realized i'd bitten off far more than I could chew and it just never looked exactly right, so I just decided to sell the truck.

[Rob]

Up to this point I've not told you how to prep the new gutter and roof skin panel:

First off when you get all your welding/patching done in preparation for the installation of new parts take a wire wheel, (or sandblaster) and clean/remove all the loose scale, and flaking corrosion. Then when all steel shows a light silver face weld your new drip rail to the cabs newly repaired rear panel. With this welding finished it is a real good time to paint all the bare steel with a corrosion inhibitive paint such a "POR-15". After drying, I then take a 3/8ths inch thick "Scotchbrite" disc and clean/remove the "e" coat from the upper horizontal portion of the drip edge to bare steel. Then place the prepared roof skin on top of the cab, align and clamp with a few sets of "Vise Grip" pliers, and get busy with the welder. As far as heat setting, you barely want to see deformation of the bottom of the drip edge horizontal area and a good melt into the upper area of the roof skin.

If you plan to weld the parts only then you will need to drill or punch a series of holes about four inches apart on the flange area of the new roof skin. I use 1/4" and have a pneumatic punch for this. 3/8ths will work but is a lot more welding and grinding to finish. You must also have holes in the drip rail to weld it to the cab panel. This is called "plug welding". I have a spot welder that works from both a single side, and double side with a squeeze clamp but I still prefer to plug weld as it is much stronger. In an earlier post I addressed the glue and screw method and it will work also but is not my preference.

Hyman Auto Supply, (based in Chicago) is the parent company of Specialty Paints whom I use for my vendor of the RustFire/RustFree products. If you have trouble give me a call and I'll send you up my applicator gun, and a gallon of the stuff. I don't think it comes in spray cans as I've never seen it. I use the undercoating set to apply it.

Rob

[Lmackattack]

Rob is this the Rust free/rust fire your talking about? I cant seam to find "Rust Fire" doing a google search?

http://www.theruststore.com/Boeshield-Rust-Free-Spray-P2C1.aspx

I may order the 3M applacator gun, 360 deg applacator hose, 3M rubber under coat to help reduce any vibrations. then spray the rust free over it all to really seal it in.

What do you think about that?

Trent

[Rob]

Rob is this the Rust free/rust fire your talking about? I cant seam to find "Rust Fire" doing a google search?

http://www.therustst...Spray-P2C1.aspx

I may order the 3M applacator gun, 360 deg applacator hose, 3M rubber under coat to help reduce any vibrations. then spray the rust free over it all to really seal it in.

What do you think about that?

Trent

No Trent that is not the correct product. This is a phosphoric acid based product much like "Naval Jelly" and is used to remove rust stains from steel parts. I will get you a vendor as I'll be at the shop in a couple of hours and call you.

The rubberized undercoating is not a bad product and I use it in the spray cans also. The Rustfree will go right over the top of it but it's not necessary to completely coat over the top. It is made for application to the inside of closed spaces such as a door shell to run into the seams and seal them up.

I'll be calling you in a bit.

Rob

[Lmackattack]

IF YOU CALL AND I DONT ANSWER I WILL CALL YOU RIGHT BACK. IM AT WORK UNTILL 5PM

TRENT

[stev]

So, maybe it is just me, but after looking through the images, i wonder why there is no option to just install a new roof over the old one. . . . . .

[Rob]

So, maybe it is just me, but after looking through the images, i wonder why there is no option to just install a new roof over the old one. . . . . .

If you trim the old roof skin leaving the horizontal portion that resides in the rain gutter you can, but I strongly suggest you don't do this. It will be rusting to where you will see it within a year and a half. If you do not trim the roof skin, it is the same size as the original and it will not physically fit without deformation to the stamping. What starts this mess is the lack of corrosion prevention both when the cabs are welded together, and afterward. If you leave the original "flange" in place, you have not removed, or inhibited this action that is taking place. There have been a couple of trucks through the shop where this is exactly what had happened. A person pays good money for a repair only to find out the quality is lacking. Upon returning to the original repair facility they are told there is "no guarantee" on rust repair. This usually doesn't make for a happy, or repeat customer; something I enjoyed for many years.

A good example of the "low buck" is not always the best value.

Rob

[Lmackattack]

Steve I was thinking the same thing at first. when Rob was telling me "wait theres more to find" I was thinking no way it could be bad besides the rear... well he was correct but I do think I cought it in time and its not as bad as it could have been if I waited 5 more years to do this job....To be honest the cab had little rust that could be seen from the out side. I only went after the rust bubbles as I wanted to make sure it did not progress below the gutter rails. Like you said...I figured that I could remove the old skin and add a new one and that was it. Then When I removed the skin, it was in better shape than all the other sheet metal under it???. The gutter was even in fair shape considering its age. The rear cab wall/corners and the front corners showed the worst of it. All these locations cant be sceen from inside or out side the cab with the roof skin on. The roof skin only had come apart at the 90 deg flange that sits in the rear rain gutter. everywhere els the skin was fine.

I took Robs advice and bought some rust prevention paint and will be buying this rust fire stuff he speaks of and doing all the cab nook and crannies that I can find. even if I have to drill a hole to get the applacater wand into a tight spot. I think its worth it to coat the seams weather rust is there or not. I know that there is more rust somewhere and buying time is cheeper than just letting it progress.

just my .02

Trent

[Lmackattack]

Update.... over the last week I was able to Cut out all the rust spots on the cab,Put in new sheet metal patches, got the rear rain gutter on the cab wall. I test fitted the roof skin and it fit in the gutters pretty damm good. I did not have to bend or bang it in the gutter. It fit like a old hat. I was kinda impresse with myself.

Today however was kinda a PITA.

the 3M rubberized paint does not like to flow thry the 360 deg wand, instead it likes to shoot out the vent hole and all over my head. I spent most of today welding and grinding on the gutter to get it ready for the roof skin. then ran out of gringing discs, Needed some 3M panel bond but the local store was all out. I will be gluing the skin on and sealing the crap out of it once installed. I know rob is not a big fan of the glue method but we will see how it holds up. I leave tomorrow for the ALMS Race in Utah this weekend so I will have to finish it next week.

Trent

[Lmackattack]

Well 2 months later and I am making good progress.

Roof went on a few weeks ago. had to riv nut all the holes to accept the horns/lights/visor etc... after I got that done I had to drill/locate the upper exhaust Brackets that bolt to the rain rail (RS-RL macks have this with exhausts that bolt to the cab)

then I had to re-make the 4 inner brackets that bolt to the inside of the cab corners. almost all the inner cab nuts that hold the stacks on were stripped out or rusted. then I found that I had to drill the inner walls to access the nuts that hold the cab handels. pretty much all the hidden nuts that you cant get to were stripped or had broke the tack welds that keep them from spinning. I have sanded the whole cab and need repaired all the dents. paint should go on by this weekend. I hope....

Race season has gotten in the way of things and it always seams I just dont have the time to get things done.

[cgallamore]

good thing you are just sprucing up the intierior a bit, i would hate to see it turn into a big job.